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PUSH PROCESSING BY TEMPERATURE


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#1 L K Keerthi Basu

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Posted 12 November 2005 - 11:56 AM

We are going to push process our final student film in our film school. We are going to use 5212 and 5218.

There is no way to chage the TIME of developing to PUSH the stock because the machine design is like that in our Film School. When we change the TIME of developing the time in other solutions will change. So we have planned to PUSH this in TEMPERATURE. We are going to push from 1 to 1 1/2 stops.
At what TEMPERATURE I have to set for 1 stop and 1 1/2 stop? I know that If it is time It will be 3 min 40sec for 1 stop and 4min 40sec for 2 stops.
We are going to shoot the test next week both for 5212 and 5218.

L.K.Keerthibasu
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#2 Laurent Andrieux

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Posted 12 November 2005 - 12:52 PM

May be it's an info you could find somewhere in the kodak's site? Otherwise, you could determine this by making tests if you have a densitometer... do you have one ?
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#3 Stephen Williams

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Posted 12 November 2005 - 01:53 PM

We are going to shoot the test next week both for 5212 and 5218.

L.K.Keerthibasu


Hi,

I have noticed that pushing Vision 2 stocks has less effect than with older stocks. Push 1 still works well.

Stephen
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#4 Charles MacDonald

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Posted 12 November 2005 - 03:48 PM

When we change the TIME of developing the time in other solutions will change.


When you are doing a negative film, You might be able to get away with that!

Their is a prewash that removes the rem jet, a bleach that re-halos the silver, a fix to get rid of the unexposed silver, some washs .. All those steps really go to completion in the reconended time, so If you extend them all, it probaly will not affect the results (much) - I am sure the lab folks will comment if I am being overly optonistic in this regard. You CAN NOT get away with Pulling as then you will be shortchanging some of the other steps.
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#5 Dirk DeJonghe

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 11:23 AM

We push ECN2 negative by running the processor slower (more time in developer) pulling is accomplished by lowering the temperature of the developer only while keeping the speed of the processor standard.

Having said this, pushing and pulling only changes the gamma of the negative, very little information is added, even if the printing lights are higher. If there is no exposure on the negative, pushing will add nothing.
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#6 John Pytlak RIP

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 04:32 PM

Push/Pull Processing:

http://www.kodak.com...4.11.4.18&lc=en

ECN-2 Processing Specifications:

http://www.kodak.com.../h247/h2407.pdf

Effect of Processing Variations:

http://www.kodak.com.../h248/h2408.pdf (data)

From the data on page 8-7, it appears that going up in temperature from 106F to 110F has a similar effect on the densities as increasing time from 3'00' to 3'40". However, the hotter processing temperature may have undesirable effects like faster deterioration of the processing chemicals or physical effects (e.g., reticulation). As noted, most labs slow the machine to give longer development times to achieve "push" processing. Why can't this be done on your machine?
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#7 L K Keerthi Basu

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 10:43 AM

thank you John,
what are the other processing difficulties I will face if I PUSH with TEMP. Is there any difference in the image from TIME PUSHING and TEMP PUSHING. If Iam PUSHING by TIME it will wont affect the negative in longer time in the other processing solutions?
We cannot change the the DEVELOPING TIME only for the DEVELOPER, because our processing plant desing is like that.

L.K.Keerthibasu
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#8 John Pytlak RIP

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 06:55 AM

thank you John,
what are the other processing difficulties I will face if I PUSH with TEMP. Is there any difference in the image from TIME PUSHING and TEMP PUSHING. If Iam PUSHING by TIME it will wont affect the negative in longer time in the other processing solutions?
We cannot change the the DEVELOPING TIME only for the DEVELOPER, because our processing plant desing is like that.

L.K.Keerthibasu


Again, running the ECN-2 process much above 106F is not a recommended procedure, so Kodak does not test for all the possible adverse effects. Any lab would run sensitometric control strips to actually measure the change in photographic characteristics with the conditions they are running. But in general, running the developer so hot will certainly cause faster deterioration (oxidation) of the chemistry. And although the film is "forehardened", higher than recommended temperatures may cause reticulation or other physical issues.
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#9 Dominic Case

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 08:09 PM

All the solutions except for developer are designed to complete the reaction during the normal time. In other words the bleach will have completely coverted ALL the silver to silver halide in a bit less than the specified three minutes, etc. So additional time won't have any effect (unless you leave the film in there for a day and a half!)

Development is designed to stop when the image is developed to a certain amount - that gives the best balance of film speed and grain, sharpness, contrast etc. Variation either way will give a different result - which is why pushing and pulling works.

If you speed up the machine, the bleach, fix , wash etc will still be OK for a vey slight reduction in time - but they may not be completed if the time is reduced enough to effect a stop or more in film speed..
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#10 L K Keerthi Basu

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Posted 20 November 2005 - 09:21 AM

Thank you John and Dominic.

I will mail after taking the test.


L.K.Keerthibasu
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