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Mole tungsten fresnels?


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#1 Riku Naskali

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Posted 29 November 2005 - 09:45 AM

Hi, I don't have any experience with Mole lighting instruments since we don't have them in here. They seem to be dirt cheap, for example Pyramid films sells 10k's for $350. I guess they are really old, maybe from the studio era. Are they any good, do they have proper focus, etc?

http://www.pyramid-f...s/10kmolesa.jpg
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#2 Dickson Sorensen

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Posted 29 November 2005 - 10:44 AM

Hi, I don't have any experience with Mole lighting instruments since we don't have them in here. They seem to be dirt cheap, for example Pyramid films sells 10k's for $350. I guess they are really old, maybe from the studio era. Are they any good, do they have proper focus, etc?

http://www.pyramid-f...s/10kmolesa.jpg


Mole/Richardson equipment is very well made however before buying used check out that they are working properly and will suit your needs. Plugs switches etc. set up for your line voltage. everything in the US is 110V. Replacement parts for Mole equipment can be gotten from Mole at www.mole.com
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#3 Sam Wells

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Posted 29 November 2005 - 11:42 AM

My ancient Juniors and Baby's served me well for years.

But honestly if I were buying I'd go for Arri, especially the 2K fresnel which will go a (sturdy) baby stand etc.

Mole does the job though. (i've bought parts from Barbizon in NYC).

-Sam
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#4 Matt Irwin

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Posted 29 November 2005 - 12:23 PM

Moles are definitely tank-proof, though the design has remain mostly the same for decades and I think there are some better, more modern designs out there. The heat vents give off a lot of spill and the some of their units dont have a top clip for the barndoors (huge pet-peeve of mine).

As Sam mentioned above, Arri's would be my first choice, especially for personal purchase. The 10k's you linked to look like they've seen a lot of use, but as stated, Moles last.
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#5 Tim Tyler

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Posted 29 November 2005 - 02:16 PM

I bought an HMI and a some used tungsten lights from Pyramid and they were all in good shape and priced nicely. Most of the units I got from them had used lamps already installed -- which is a small plus.

The biggest problem with the old Mole lights is that they're big and heavy compared to today's small aluminum lights. You may draw a few odd looks on set too depending on who the client is. :)
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#6 Matt Irwin

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Posted 29 November 2005 - 03:42 PM

You may draw a few odd looks on set too depending on who the client is. :)

Just paint 'em black and no one will be the wiser! B)
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#7 Riku Naskali

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Posted 29 November 2005 - 06:25 PM

Thanks for the replies, very informative indeed. I've always used Arri myself, too. Of course the quality is top notch, but they cost big bucks.

I don't think the difference would be that big, after all we're not talking about any fancy electronics. The conversion to 220v should be pretty simple, I'd just change the wiring, plug, fuse and the bulb.

Cosmetics won't be a problem and I can always get more electricians for more muscle power <_<
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#8 Marco Leavitt

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Posted 30 November 2005 - 05:06 PM

I'm curious as to why people seem to prefer Arri. I just bought a couple of Mole Tweenie II fresnels and I think they're just great. They don't seem significantly larger or heavier than the Arri 650 fresnel. In fact, B&H lists the weight of the Arri 650 at 7.21 lbs. and the Mole 650 at 6.75 lbs. I've had pretty limited experience with the Arri lights, but the performance seems pretty similar to me. To be honest, I just went with Mole because I like the old fashioned look of the lights, and they seem to be way tougher. Did I make a mistake? The salesman at B&H did say Mole's not so popular anymore.
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#9 oscar jimenez

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Posted 30 November 2005 - 08:04 PM

Well, I just know that Mole Richardson are heavy, the heat up incredibly, Sturdy as a tank, two same lamps wont focus the same ( on old ones ) but, if they are cheap, go. Theres also the option of Desisti, they are good, somewhat lighter.
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#10 Sam Wells

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Posted 30 November 2005 - 08:11 PM

I've used Tweenies a lot, less of a difference there.

I prefer Arri doors..

I've also used Ianiro in these sizes...

Just do good work, no one will care what you bought :)

-Sam
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#11 David Sweetman

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Posted 30 November 2005 - 09:25 PM

I've had a hastle in the past with the mole barndors. The lever is a son-of-a-gun when it's hot, and they can't seem to stay on. I'll probably still end up buying some, since you can find them cheap, although i prefer to use arris.
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#12 timHealy

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 12:01 AM

Those look like old Studio Mole 10ks. I don't think they are the old Big Eye type. If I can reiterate what has been said, they are very heavy and not "ideal" for location work compared to the contemporary aluminum models. Being old they may have bad flood spot mechanisms. The wiring may be old, have dry rot, and may not be grounded like contemporary models. If you want to by them for a stage where they will live on stands 100 percent of the time (hence the name "Studio 10k's"), and you do your inspection properly, or plan to resurrect them, then maybe they would be OK to buy. Otherwise I wouldn't bother. They may need alot of work to keep them going.

Just my 2 cents

Best

Tim

Edited by heel_e, 01 December 2005 - 12:04 AM.

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#13 timHealy

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 12:19 AM

I'm curious as to why people seem to prefer Arri. I just bought a couple of Mole Tweenie II fresnels and I think they're just great. They don't seem significantly larger or heavier than the Arri 650 fresnel. In fact, B&H lists the weight of the Arri 650 at 7.21 lbs. and the Mole 650 at 6.75 lbs. I've had pretty limited experience with the Arri lights, but the performance seems pretty similar to me. To be honest, I just went with Mole because I like the old fashioned look of the lights, and they seem to be way tougher. Did I make a mistake? The salesman at B&H did say Mole's not so popular anymore.


When was the last time you believed in what a salesman said? The majority of B and H sales and customers are still photography not cinematography. Mole is doing just fine in the tungsten filmmaking world.

Personally for me the Mole tungsten stuff is terrific, easy to use, and tested over decades. Except that Mighties and mickeys don't feel as easy to use as blondes and redheads to me. Arri Tungsten products are fine too except the seem to run a little cooler in terms of color temp than Mole. I would say that I would prefer to use the Arri version of blondes and redheads over Moles mighties and mickeys. However I have never been a big fan of Mole HMI's. They don't seem to be user friendly and the designs seem overly bulky. Arri's HMI's on the other hand are terrific. I like all their HMI products with 2 caveats. The 18k seems a little bulky and I like utilizing a sun ray 18 or the like, and the Arri 12/18 k HMI par is a monster! It may be too big for most electric trucks and may have to be carried on a swing or rigging truck.

Best

tim
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#14 Luke Prendergast

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 01:10 AM

Arri Tungsten products are fine too except the seem to run a little cooler in terms of color temp than Mole.


This color temp variance is highly unlikely given that a tungsten fresnel is a lamp in a box with a piece of glass in front and a mains plug wired on. Supposing they are using the same lamp type of course.
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#15 Elhanan Matos

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 01:57 AM

The only Arri lights I have ever seen on sets are the 650's and 1k's for tungsten lights and then the 1200 and 4k HMI's. I always see Mole lights for tungsten and LTM's for HMI's.
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#16 timHealy

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 08:10 AM

This color temp variance is highly unlikely given that a tungsten fresnel is a lamp in a box with a piece of glass in front and a mains plug wired on. Supposing they are using the same lamp type of course.



Have you tried to take two similiar wattage lights one from arri and one from mole and bounce it into the same sort of bounce media and make a side by side comparision? I have and arris run a little cooler. Try it yourself if you don't believe me. Maybe it only 100 or 200 degrees kelvin but it is differnent enough that is noticeable if mixing the lights. If you use all of one brand on a job you won't notice.

Best

Tim
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#17 Michael Morlan

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 03:30 PM

There is a reason Mole's designs haven't changed for decades - they work. Really, most lights are relatively simple devices.

Besides formfactor, features, and materials, take a close look at illumination tables available on most manufacturers' sites. These tell the true story of how much light and the character of light each instrument projects. You would be surprised, for instance, at the difference between Mole's 2000watt 412 Junior and their 2000watt 4131 Baby Junior, which is less efficient.

Pyramid Films is a good place to buy used, but be careful. I have received some real crap from the end of their inventory at times. Dave worked really hard to give me satisfaction, however, sending me additional parts to bring my purchase up to an acceptable spec.

Edited by Michael Morlan, 01 December 2005 - 03:33 PM.

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#18 Paul Bruening

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Posted 08 December 2005 - 04:04 AM

I bought 4 of the 5Ks from the tip on this thread from P-F.com. They were only $125.00 per. The globes for them cost more. Mole sells these units new for $1,510.00. I'll see what condition they show up in.
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#19 Riku Naskali

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Posted 08 December 2005 - 02:28 PM

I bought 4 of the 5Ks from the tip on this thread from P-F.com. They were only $125.00 per. The globes for them cost more. Mole sells these units new for $1,510.00. I'll see what condition they show up in.

Cool, please share your experiences when you get them :)
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