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TOTALLY BLUNDERED!! SDI replacement?


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#1 Pavel

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Posted 23 December 2005 - 11:00 AM

hi all!
we are a small ads production studio from remote in russia.
recently decided to upgrade from DVCAM to SDX900 but were not clever enough to think about capturing material.
now the situation is: the 900, NO sdi option inside, NO vtr.
what we need during 2.5 months until sdi option with sdi pc-card ships here: need a solution to capture, grab, input video into PC with a better quality than with pinnacle dv pc-card (via 900 composite output, well maybe not composite, the one on the rear panel, quality was extremely bad, you understand, particularily for keying).

need to start returning money fast %) have work to do, projects and clients. only thing we have not is that high quality capture %)

please, describe possible variants.

thank you
Pavel
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#2 Gordon Highland

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Posted 23 December 2005 - 11:50 AM

There really isn't one, other than renting a deck as needed (I don't know if they're available in your area). Could you hire someone and ship your tapes out, and have them capture them for you onto a portable hard drive (or burn data DVDs) to send back? Can you buy yourself enough time to work "offline" for now with just the composite captures for client approval, and recreate the full-quality versions later?
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#3 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 23 December 2005 - 12:23 PM

Hi,

Isn't there a 1394 option board for the SDX-900?

Phil
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#4 Peter J DeCrescenzo

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Posted 23 December 2005 - 01:34 PM

Isn't there a 1394 option board for the SDX-900?

Nope.
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#5 Peter J DeCrescenzo

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Posted 23 December 2005 - 02:38 PM

... were not clever enough to think about capturing material. now the situation is: the 900, NO sdi option inside, NO vtr. what we need during 2.5 months until sdi option with sdi pc-card ships here: need a solution to capture ...

Please confirm with your Panasonic dealer/vendor (or a SDX-900 owner here) whether or not their SDI option for the SDX-900 can output _tape playback_ from the camcorder.

Not all camcorder SDI option cards can do this. For example, Sony's SDI option card for their DSR-450WSL and other cams only outputs the camera's "live" video & audio, _not_ tape playback. Of course, the DSR-450WSL can play out via its standard Firewire, composite and audio connectors.

However, if Panasonic's SDI option can output both tape playback and live A/V from their camcorder, then my hat's off to them!
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#6 Pavel

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Posted 24 December 2005 - 04:35 AM

Gordon,
the idea of out-of-the-area capturing is allright, thanks!
Because we have not very big ads projects and they are usually completed in several days.




Are these statements true: we'd better take realtime SDI signal to have something keyed, for other post production let it be DVCPRO50 (there is some outdoor footage to be).

Peter, thanks for the info on tape playback feature. we'll find out.
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#7 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 24 December 2005 - 07:37 AM

Hi,

> we'd better take realtime SDI signal to have something keyed,

Yes. Or, you could take firewire, which would be compressed, but only as compressed as the tape itself. The results would be as good either way.

> for other post production let it be DVCPRO50 (there is some outdoor footage to be).

No difference. If you are editing on an Apple Mac and take it as firewire DVCPRO50, that's not going to be any worse than the SDI. The SDI output can't put back information that was lost during compression, and DVCPRO50 is an 8-bit format anyway, even though the SDI is 10-bit.

Phil
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#8 Pavel

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Posted 24 December 2005 - 04:35 PM

>> we'd better take realtime SDI signal to have something keyed,
> Yes. Or, you could take firewire, which would be compressed, but only as compressed as the tape itself. The results would be as good either way.


Peter DeCrescenzo says there's no firewire in SDI option. Only in VTR.


>> for other post production let it be DVCPRO50 (there is some outdoor footage to be).
> No difference ...


I mean, for us, shooting for keying is usually a studio work => let it be 10 bits (via no compression codec) of realtime output.


Thanks everybody for understanding my English and for respond, I didn't expect so much %)

Edited by Pavel, 24 December 2005 - 04:36 PM.

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#9 Mitch Gross

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Posted 25 December 2005 - 02:25 AM

However, if Panasonic's SDI option can output both tape playback and live A/V from their camcorder, then my hat's off to them!


Yes, the SDX900 does allow this. I know a couple of owner/ops who capture from the camera in this manner.
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#10 Freya Black

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Posted 25 December 2005 - 08:03 AM

Yes, the SDX900 does allow this. I know a couple of owner/ops who capture from the camera in this manner.



I looked into this. There is no Firewire for the camera, even as an option, which seems a little silly to me but Mitch is right, you can output via SDI from tape. There are also now some panasonic decks with firewire, they might be very expensive tho.

I'm not sure how much the SDI option would cost but perhaps that and a black magic decklink card would be the cheapest way to go?

love

Freya
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#11 Pavel

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Posted 25 December 2005 - 10:42 AM

There is no Firewire for the camera...
I'm not sure how much the SDI option would cost but perhaps that and a black magic decklink card would be the cheapest way to go?

the absence of firewire is another said issue we discovered after buying the 900 %)

lyrical digression:
why weren't we ready for so many things, why didn't know? it's simple. the man who has money and actually decided to develop studio, runs several media businesses in our town. he is too busy to find out all things concerning the topic. and there are no specialists in our town. the best thing they have here in governmental arsenal are some versions of analogue betacam slightly better than dvcam. besides, without money paid for knowledge, will anyone like to select the right equipment? nope.



Conclusion.
1. There is no practically suitable temporal solution since there are no equipment of the quality in our district.
2. We shall be waiting for the SDI option which is extra ~ $1000, and blackmagic sdi, $300.
3. I will insist on buying the bonsai drive, a substitution for cassetes and VTR (!!!).


Thanks everyone! ;)

Edited by Pavel, 25 December 2005 - 10:51 AM.

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#12 Pavel

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Posted 09 January 2006 - 03:07 PM

Conclusion.
1. There is no practically suitable temporal solution since there are no equipment of the quality in our district.
2. We shall be waiting for the SDI option which is extra ~ $1000, and blackmagic sdi, $300.
3. I will insist on buying the bonsai drive, a substitution for cassetes and VTR (!!!).



Hi everyone once again,

Did anyone really work with the configuration?
I mean the 900, SDI option and Blackmagic DeckLink (not pro or higher).

On DeckLink, there is the Deck Control RS-422 conector, and having never worked with equipment of such quality and level, we are confused, will it be used with the SDI option? How? :)

It's insane - capturing DV50 via SDI (8 -> 10 bit), but it's a cheap solution, exactly what we need, besides there will be studio work with some direct 900->DeckLink stream. And a BonsaiDrive later (then we will admittedly forget DV50 at all).

Also, no external clock generator seemes to be needed with these devices?
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