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16mm one light transfer


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#1 Clampet15

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Posted 11 January 2006 - 11:53 PM

Hello, I'm currently in the final stages of shooting my first feature length. I'm in the process of looking at labs with the best pricing, seeing that I'm a student and this project is super low buget. I found one lab online that has some pretty great prices and student rates, but I have just one question before I send off the goods. The pricing they gave me for a one light vs. a graded is about a 500 dollar difference. Now this might not be much money in the industry, but thats a hefty chunk to me when its comming out of my pocket. Now I am finishing this project on digital, so my major concerns are resolution (which I assume the both are pretty close to the same), and of course color. I totally get the idea behind using the highest quality image possible when going in, but I know for a fact I am going to be grading this stuff after the fact either way. My main question is, If I just go ahead and get a one light even though I did use different stocks and what not, will I be able to create a decent looking picture after tampering with the image in post. I would just hate to pay this place an extra 500 bucks for something I can very well do myself on my own. But I would also hate to pay over a thousand dollars for a bunch of crap.

-Brandon
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#2 Stephen Williams

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Posted 12 January 2006 - 05:01 AM

Hello, I'm currently in the final stages of shooting my first feature length. I'm in the process of looking at labs with the best pricing, seeing that I'm a student and this project is super low buget. I found one lab online that has some pretty great prices and student rates, but I have just one question before I send off the goods. The pricing they gave me for a one light vs. a graded is about a 500 dollar difference. Now this might not be much money in the industry, but thats a hefty chunk to me when its comming out of my pocket. Now I am finishing this project on digital, so my major concerns are resolution (which I assume the both are pretty close to the same), and of course color. I totally get the idea behind using the highest quality image possible when going in, but I know for a fact I am going to be grading this stuff after the fact either way. My main question is, If I just go ahead and get a one light even though I did use different stocks and what not, will I be able to create a decent looking picture after tampering with the image in post. I would just hate to pay this place an extra 500 bucks for something I can very well do myself on my own. But I would also hate to pay over a thousand dollars for a bunch of crap.

-Brandon



Hi,

You need to do a test and establish for yourself. I am aware of some labs that usually produce crap, however much you spend!

Stephen
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#3 Mike Crane

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Posted 12 January 2006 - 12:58 PM

There are still some places that take some additional care with a on-light. One of them is Spectra Film and Video. I sent them a good deal of neg expecting a typical one-light and got back footage that had obviously been tweaked (including an 85 filter problem I had). They have some especially low rates for 16mm, but you must contact them for the info since it is not posted on their web page.
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#4 Clampet15

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Posted 12 January 2006 - 02:02 PM

There are still some places that take some additional care with a on-light. One of them is Spectra Film and Video. I sent them a good deal of neg expecting a typical one-light and got back footage that had obviously been tweaked (including an 85 filter problem I had). They have some especially low rates for 16mm, but you must contact them for the info since it is not posted on their web page.



Thats is very good to know, seeing that is was spectra that I am talking to right now. Looks like my mind is set. I still might send just a demo roll to check it out. But I am glad to hear they do a good job. Thanks.
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#5 Jaan Shenberger

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Posted 12 January 2006 - 02:44 PM

Brandon, there was a similar thread about how to handle transfer/post on a 16mm feature with a finish on digital. it includes a post by me describing a workflow that i'd highly recommend...

http://www.cinematog...wtopic=9351&hl=

hope this helps,
jaan
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#6 steve hyde

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Posted 12 January 2006 - 05:38 PM

I use CinePost in Atlanta: www.posthouse.com for rank transfers at 135.00 USD per hour to DVcam. If your project is "super low budget" go for a super low budget transfer. Keep your EDLs organized and you can always conform your edits back to your film reels in a color correction session at some place like www.fsft.com

or just work with your cheap rank transfer and call it good.

Your extra money might be better spent on your next project. If your feature gets picked up the distributor will likely pay for the high-end post production.

Steve
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#7 Clampet15

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Posted 12 January 2006 - 06:24 PM

I use CinePost in Atlanta: www.posthouse.com for rank transfers at 135.00 USD per hour to DVcam. If your project is "super low budget" go for a super low budget transfer. Keep your EDLs organized and you can always conform your edits back to your film reels in a color correction session at some place like www.fsft.com

or just work with your cheap rank transfer and call it good.

Your extra money might be better spent on your next project. If your feature gets picked up the distributor will likely pay for the high-end post production.

Steve



Yeah, I'm thinking thats the best way to go with the lowest budget route possible. I'm pretty confident I can at most, make the footage look decent. I am pretty much using all of the footage, so going back later on wont be to hard. I'll make sure to keep track of the EDL's just incase I get lucky one day. Thanks.
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#8 John Pytlak RIP

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Posted 12 January 2006 - 09:28 PM

Hello, I'm currently in the final stages of shooting my first feature length. I'm in the process of looking at labs with the best pricing, seeing that I'm a student and this project is super low buget. I found one lab online that has some pretty great prices and student rates, but I have just one question before I send off the goods. The pricing they gave me for a one light vs. a graded is about a 500 dollar difference. Now this might not be much money in the industry, but thats a hefty chunk to me when its comming out of my pocket. Now I am finishing this project on digital, so my major concerns are resolution (which I assume the both are pretty close to the same), and of course color. I totally get the idea behind using the highest quality image possible when going in, but I know for a fact I am going to be grading this stuff after the fact either way. My main question is, If I just go ahead and get a one light even though I did use different stocks and what not, will I be able to create a decent looking picture after tampering with the image in post. I would just hate to pay this place an extra 500 bucks for something I can very well do myself on my own. But I would also hate to pay over a thousand dollars for a bunch of crap.

-Brandon


Kodak has developed technology to aid transfer houses with automatic assistance to the colorist:

http://www.kodak.com...cs/index2.shtml

http://www.kodak.com...upport/tcs2.pdf

Maintain creativity with greater control from shoot to post with the KODAK Telecine Calibration System (TCS). This indispensable digital postproduction tool lets you transfer more image information than ever before. With vastly improved image quality and consistency, it captures all the information from KODAK Color Negative Films automatically, minimizing the need for re-transfers.


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#9 Andrew Koch

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Posted 21 January 2006 - 08:58 PM

What format are you transferring to? If you are planning to do your own color correction, I would avoid DVCAM, miniDV or any other DV25 format because of the 4:1:1 color. This compression gives you limited access to tweak with the colors. BetacamSP, or even better, Digibeta and DVCPRO50 (not standard DVCPRO) all have less compression and 4:2:2 color, which gives you nicer images and much more flexibility with color correction as far as Standard Definition formats are concerned. I am also a student. The first short film I shot was a onelight and I regret it to this day. (The only reason I didn't supervise was that I was told I wasn't allowed by the school and I was too naive to believe otherwise). The colorist made arbitrary decisions about what it was supposed to look like, and there was no way to fix it on an NLE.

I have found that, regardless of the quality of work, several post facilities have a tendancy to do half assed jobs when they know it is a student production. If the one-light is bad, it may not be fixable on your computer. For example: If the colorist cranks the exposure on an image to the point where clipping occurs, it is impossible to restore that detail once it goes to tape.

If you are not going to be able to supervise your telecine, but plan to do the color correction yourself, make sure you have as much information to work with as possible. This means you leave a note telling the colorist to avoid letting the highlights clip and preserve detail in the shadows. This will result in a relatively flat image, allowing you to have access to the higlights and shadows while you are doing your own color correcting. Once you get it the way you want it, then you can crush the blacks and blow the highlights all you want. If you start out with crushed blacks and blown highlights, you will have a very hard time color correcting. Make sure you go to a post facility that understands your workflow.

I hope this helps.
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Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Aerial Filmworks

Broadcast Solutions Inc

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Visual Products

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Willys Widgets

Wooden Camera

Metropolis Post

Rig Wheels Passport

Tai Audio

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Opal

Glidecam

The Slider

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Technodolly