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Cable pulling when moving lights along with tracking camera


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#1 Igor Trajkovski

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Posted 06 February 2006 - 10:51 PM

A situation seen on MTV's Making the Video.
I thing it was (???) Janet Jackson and Miss Eliot video:

Big basement garage in a building.
Group of 3-4 girls sing and walk forward
in front of retreating camera on (trackless) dolly.
Left and right of the camera 2 PAs hold horizontaly
Kinoflo 4-bank each. They walk backwards along with the camera.

Quastion: How is the cable pulling managed?
I mean the power to the Kinos.

Back then sideways? Until it is out of frame.
Or all the way just backwords?

Thanks!

Regards,

Igor Trajkovski
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#2 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 07 February 2006 - 06:41 AM

Hi,

Put some people on it!

Or, run the kinos from battery power - it's just barely possible to run a 4-bank from PAGs.

Phil
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#3 Andrew Alward

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Posted 09 February 2006 - 01:06 AM

Get 2 extra electricians (or PAs) way back behind camera, pulling up the slack from the stingers supplying power to the kinos. Then have 2 other PAs rap up the pulled slack in a neat coiled pile, so it's not just junked up. Stingers arn't heavy. :D
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#4 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 09 February 2006 - 03:33 AM

Don't you mean to say 'Stingers'?
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#5 Igor Trajkovski

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Posted 10 February 2006 - 08:34 PM

Thanks.

So i'll need:
2 PA's at the Flo's
2 PA's/elec's on the stingers("pulling up the slack") - holding and moving along
2 PA's Waaaay back pulling and wraping/coiling the cable
====================================================
TOTAL: 6 Man to pull it off.

Neat! :)


Regards

Igor
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#6 Andrew Alward

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 01:05 PM

Thanks.

So i'll need:
2 PA's at the Flo's
2 PA's/elec's on the stingers("pulling up the slack") - holding and moving along
2 PA's Waaaay back pulling and wraping/coiling the cable
====================================================
TOTAL: 6 Man to pull it off.

Neat! :)
Regards

Igor


Actually, electricians should be doing most of the work, then get PAs where you need them. Also, good electricians should beable to pull cable and rap it at the same time(even with 60, or 100amp cable). Plus, they are only small stinger cables, so they won't be that difficult to deal with if they get jumbled up, so you should be fine getting it done with just 4 people.
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#7 Hal Smith

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 04:03 PM

There's a technique that I learned from pro divers where you pull cable while down on your knees and over and under coiling it on the deck as you pull, they use this to pull diver's hose up while an underwater diver is surfacing. It makes it a LOT easier to be on your knees (with knee pads!!!) pulling and coiling. I haven't been on enough professional film shoots to know whether pro gaffers do this or not - but if not - try it. I'm thinking this would get you down to a gaffer and a PA per light - assuming PA's bright enough to learn proper cable coiling. ;)


Edmond, OK
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#8 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 04:10 AM

There's a technique that I learned from pro divers where you pull cable while down on your knees and over and under coiling it on the deck as you pull, they use this to pull diver's hose up while an underwater diver is surfacing. It makes it a LOT easier to be on your knees (with knee pads!!!) pulling and coiling. I haven't been on enough professional film shoots to know whether pro gaffers do this or not - but if not - try it. I'm thinking this would get you down to a gaffer and a PA per light - assuming PA's bright enough to learn proper cable coiling. ;)
Edmond, OK

It's not a good idea to over/under those cables. At least that's what a gaffer friend of mine used to tell me. Once you wrap stingers over/over a few time they become trained and are easy to wrap the same way every time.
I used to work on golf with ESPN and ABC as a utility, and we would pull and over/under 120,000 ft of triax for each event, in 500 ft and 1000 ft lengths. I spent more hours than I care to remember hunched over a pile of cable in the middle of a fairway. Off topic, but your post brought back some memories.
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#9 Igor Trajkovski

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 07:33 PM

What is exactly over/under coilling?
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#10 Cole Webley

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Posted 14 February 2006 - 03:33 AM

This is really hard to answer in writing...do you have any sound buddies? They could show you (XLR cables are wrapped over/under)

Best of luck.
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#11 kata

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Posted 14 February 2006 - 11:17 PM

over/under: arm in front, flexed 90 degrees like holding a shoulder cam lens. pull cable over/thru hand, slip behind/under elbow, bring up to hand. continue. (coil cable with the "wrapping" hand)

is that correct?
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#12 Chris Keth

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Posted 15 February 2006 - 12:55 AM

over/under: arm in front, flexed 90 degrees like holding a shoulder cam lens. pull cable over/thru hand, slip behind/under elbow, bring up to hand. continue. (coil cable with the "wrapping" hand)

is that correct?



I'll do my best to explain over-under coiling. Alright, start by making a loop about a foot in diameter. When you make this loop, place the long trailing end of the cable over the short end in your hand. The next loop you make, you will do something similar, but you will make it so that the long free end of the cable ends up under the loop you make. This way, you will make a half twist in the cable each loop, but in alternating directions so the 'net twist', so to speak, on the cable is zero.

I made a quick, dumb paint drawing to help. It illustrates the first and second loops, after that you just repeat. The breaks in the "cable" in my drawing are there to illustrate which part of the cable goes over which. When you look at it, remember that those loops will be stacked, but I drew them seperately for clarity.

Edited by Christopher D. Keth, 15 February 2006 - 12:56 AM.

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#13 boy yniguez

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Posted 15 February 2006 - 04:17 AM

simply put, it means when you are starting to coil the cable, every odd-numbered loop is on one side of the coil and all even-numbered loop is on the opposite side. this is to prevent twisting the cable as you go along.

boy y
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#14 Igor Trajkovski

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Posted 16 February 2006 - 08:09 PM

Thanks all for your ove-under coiling input.

I thought i got it. But!...

To make sure i am on the right track,
i did some search and found
this great video on how to do it:

http://stagecraft.th...lery/cablewrap/

Now i know!
:)


Best,

Igor Trajkovski
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#15 Hal Smith

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Posted 16 February 2006 - 10:10 PM

Thanks all for your ove-under coiling input.

I thought i got it. But!...

To make sure i am on the right track,
i did some search and found
this great video on how to do it:

http://stagecraft.th...lery/cablewrap/

Now i know!
:)
Best,

Igor Trajkovski

Igor, thanks for finding the demo video, it is a very good visual on the technique. What I was referring to in my post in this thread is doing exactly what the demonstration video shows but coiling the cable on the deck rather than holding the coils in your hand.

Edmond, OK
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Aerial Filmworks

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Tai Audio

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