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Musicians vs. Filmmakers


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#1 Jonathan Spear

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 01:54 PM

Considering the fact that music and filmmaking are both forms of art and are often intertwined and used in tandom to tell a story, I'd like to make an observation.

Musicians, for the most part, strike me as more "down to earth" and approachable types. I'm a musician (guitar + composition for what it's worth) and a member of several music related forums and there's always a sense of humble comraderie shared with the other members. Noobs are always welcome and rarely get the type of treatment many of the younger members of this board get.

Many filmmakers on the other hand (screenwriting, cinematography, etc) come off as a more rogue, elitist group. Snobs, premadonnas and brown-nosing aren't hard to find on filmmaking forums.

Why is that? Is that because this art revolves around money?
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#2 Daniel J. Ashley-Smith

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 02:35 PM

Yeh I agree musicians do seem more, down to earth. One reason might be that film makers work in a lot of money, whereas in music you don't have to be rich to be good. You can play at a professional level no matter who you are, at almost any age.

Thing is a lot of people don't realise they can't do half the stuff they do in these big movies. I'm guilty of that, I think I could shoot these big features, but if I got my butt out there into one I reckon I'd shortly see that I couldn't. So that might bring more arrogance to the field in one way, which brings on elitism.

But I also play the guitar, and I know for a FACT that I can't pull of slash style solos, because I've tried it and can't do it to save my life. So I know I'm a noob, and I'll accept it.

I've played with a few top class musicians, Wim Roelants is one, and that guy seriously boosted my conifdence in the guitar, awesome guy. He wasn't like, uhhh... get off the stage, you're not that good so I'm not going to talk to you, loser.

Not that I'm having a dig at film makers here, but this is one interesting thread, with valid points.
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#3 Josh Bass

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 02:43 PM

Daniel: Major cool points for mentioning Slash, but. . .

Musicians down to earth? Are you kidding?

Axl Rose = massive cocksucker (God love him)
Tommy Lee = same
Rappers = known for killing each other, abuse of women, etc.

Need I go on?

I'm sure there're good and bad apples in both fields (which is what David Mullen'll say when he responds).

Edited by Josh Bass, 11 February 2006 - 02:48 PM.

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#4 Joe M

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 02:47 PM

As a musician myself I can say that I have met my fair share of premadonnas and snobs and I have seen a great deal of ass-kissing and schmoozing as well. There are just as many backstabbers in the music business (or ANY business). I think musicians are more easy going because there is a different lifestyle involved. We like to party 24/7 whereas filmmakers seem to be more immersed in nerdery. Nothing wrong with that though. Just different lifestyles.
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#5 Ryan Bajornas

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 03:14 PM

you're comparing 2 things for the wrong reasons. sure, you've got talented folks on both sides, but to say that one side is nicer, ha. it's like asking yourself if you like you're right foot better than your left hand.
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#6 Michael Most

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 03:47 PM

Musicians, for the most part, strike me as more "down to earth" and approachable types. .....
Many filmmakers on the other hand (screenwriting, cinematography, etc) come off as a more rogue, elitist group. Snobs, premadonnas and brown-nosing aren't hard to find on filmmaking forums.

Why is that? Is that because this art revolves around money?


Having worked with a lot of actors and musicians - usually at the same time - I can tell you that there's a very interesting mutual admiration society between them. Actors generally love having musicians around, particularly ones that have tasted significant success. When I was working on "Ally McBeal," I saw this repeatedly. From a personal point of view, I found that I met a number of musicians I considered highly inspirational, some more than others, of course. The Rev. Al Green comes to mind immediately as one of the most inspirational, joyful human beings I have ever met. I wouldn't necessarily say the same about most actors, however.
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#7 Ryan Bajornas

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 04:18 PM

the thing is, musicians can usually get together and combine their talents and it doesn't cost a thing. when people get together to make a movie, there's going to be a cost. so there's automatically an investment involved, and when money's on the line, so you have pressure to perform.
also, in movies, the positions are very defined, people often only do their job . but while the cost of making movies goes down, with the accessibility to video and editing and the internet, more and more are experimenting, you don't have things the traditional way. and nowadays people can get together and make a movie for fun without much cost. it's not like playing music together, but there's no harm if you screw up.
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#8 Tony_Beazley

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 04:57 PM

I live in Nashville. Trust me its 50/50.There's good guys and bad guys on both sides. I meet them everyday and work with them on music and film.

Some of them think they are hot poop and some know they are not- referring to musicians here.

There are more snobs on the music side of this town than on the video side ....even worse are the producers...they don't even say hi to God. lol

Edited by TonyB, 11 February 2006 - 04:58 PM.

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#9 Dan Goulder

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 11:26 PM

Going negative can convey a position of superiority. It's a proven method of getting over on people with low self-esteem. It's generally practiced by people who also have low self-esteem. One way to fight back is to go to the health club and get yourself a steam.
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#10 dd3stp233

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 08:17 AM

I think a major difference in the two is that (live)music is made in real time as opposed to film where things tend to need to be planned ahead of time. Musicians are creating their art in the moment. Just setting up a camera can take hours, let alone and the other stuff that needs to be done(scripts, sets,etc). Not very many filmmakers do improvised movies. A guitarist can just grab his/her guitar and star playing. Movies can be very expensive to make. So their are not too many people that can make movies just for the love of it without some commecial factors in mind. Their are many musicians out there that play for the love of music. Musicians that I know do seem a bit cooler (in general, there are many exceptions). There seems to be more competition in filmmaking or between filmakers. Which, if you have not seen the studies, has been should to reduce creativity.
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#11 David Sweetman

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 09:09 AM

Musicians vs. Filmmakers? It's all-out WAAAAARRRRR!

Whoever wins...we lose.
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#12 Josh Bass

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 10:45 AM

But in the dark underbelly of the earth, something new is being born. . .


A HYBRID MUSICIAN-FILMMAKER! WITH THE POWERS OF BOTH, AND THE WEAKNESSES OF NEITHER! UNSTOPPABLE!
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#13 Rik Andino

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 11:43 PM

Well this is a funny (but not silly) argument...

I think there's a problem in defining an artist...

While music and film can both be artforms...
And while most muscians are somewhat artist--filmmakers aren't really artist.

Most filmmakers are technicians or artisans or craft-people
Sorta like masons who can carve sculptures but they aren't really artist or sculptors.

Filmmaking is a combination of many skills and some of them are creative forms of art...
But in general the process of filmmaking is not really an art--it's more of an industry or trade-skill.

So you can't compare a filmmaker with a musician...
especially when you talking about cinematographers or grips, or sound mixers, camera people.

Now with that said there is a sort of guild attitude amongst filmmakers
Sort of a secret society the keeps the esoteric knowledge...
And that is often interpretted by many outsiders as a snobby attitude amongst filmmakers.

But working with many muscians via music videos
I find many muscians to be difficult to handle
Some can be tempremental, fickle, emotional, sensitive, and general moody and some are even unstable.

While usually filmmakers I find to be very stable individuals...
You'll never see a filmmaker walk into set and say "I don't feel like shooting today. I'm not in the mood."
Since it's a money-driven industry people don't take that crap from filmmakers.

But quite often muscians cancel shows or appearance cause they don't feel like playing
And when they do play a set that they're not in the mood to do, it is often bad or mediocre.
Music is something that most people consider to be from the heart and soul...
You have to feel it to do it good so they give musicians leeway to act up.

However I will say this most muscians are easy to get along on a social level--just don't work with them.


If you want to make a fairer comparison
Try filmmakers vs sound studio engineers, they're both technically inclined people.
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#14 Josh Bass

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 12:09 AM

"filmmakers aren't really artist."

You smokin' the crack, dude?

I could understand if you meant grips, or camera assistants (no offense), but gaffers, DPs, writers, directors, how are they not artists? Sure there's some technical knowledge required, but it's not like it's all about the gear. You have to know how to use it to fit the particular story, blah blah blah etc. The above listed positions are hardly technicians

Maybe I misunderstood.
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#15 Ryan Bajornas

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 02:11 AM

everyone's an artist, or so they hope to be considered, otherwise they would'nt be in the business to begin with.
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#16 Dominik Muench

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 04:55 AM

ive been playing drums in various metal bands for around 6 years :)
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#17 Jonathan Spear

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 08:14 AM

""ive been playing drums in various metal bands for around 6 years""

What feels more natural, being behind a drum set or behind a camera?
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#18 Matt Sandstrom

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 09:02 AM

the main difference is of course that music noobs are much more humble and friendly than the ultra cocky and often hostile filmmaking noobs you have to face every god damn day. ;-)

"my dv camera is better than your dv camera"

/matt
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#19 Dominik Muench

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 02:47 PM

""ive been playing drums in various metal bands for around 6 years""

What feels more natural, being behind a drum set or behind a camera?



good question, i enjoyed both, but now i dont have the time anymore to play drums...because i play with my camera :)
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#20 Dan Goulder

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 06:20 PM

good question, i enjoyed both, but now i dont have the time anymore to play drums...because i play with my camera

Your camera must have a lot of dents in it.

Seriously, having decent rhythm is essential both in performing music, or performing film edits. Bad editing is an exhibition of bad rhythm.
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