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16mm Kodachrome AND should I go to Super16?


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#1 Erdwolf_TVL

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Posted 11 February 2006 - 02:40 PM

I received back my first roll of 16mm Kodachrome today. Naturally, I am very impressed with the results!

The K3's speed and registration is MUCH better than I have ever imagined!

It works out at about the same cost per minute as Super-8 Negative printed to Positive.

The turnaround time is much shorter, though. I doubt whether I will use colour negative with 16mm any time soon. It promises to be very expensive.

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Looking for suggestions. I don't know whether it is worth going for Super-16 on my K3. I am an enthusiast. I don't film for money yet. I don't have a Super-16 projector. Most of my work is for 4:3 projection or output to standard video. Plus, I see no need to risk losing a fully working camera...

But the unexposed area of film IS a bit of an eye-sore on the raw stock.

Is the upgrade recommended?
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#2 Will Montgomery

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 12:13 AM

I would suggest going ahead and doing the S16 mod.

At the moment you are projecting and transfering to SD, but in the future you WILL be transfering to HD... maybe not for another 5 years, but soon it will be more affordable and all your TV's will be HD. Then at that point you'll have the aspect ratio needed on all your older film.

Remember, it makes no difference whether or not you use the S16 frame now, especially if you don't modify the K3 viewfinder because you'll still see the regular 16 frame when shooting. You can keep shooting as you do now, just when you eventually need the extra area it will be there.

If you are projecting, try the Ektachrome 100D. When Kodachrome 16mm is gone that will be your stock, and I think you'll be happy with it. I think its $35 direct from Kodak.

Don't be afraid of negative stocks, especially if you transfer to video... they will blow you away with their quality and latitude. Especially the new Vision2 50D.

Another tip with the K3, make sure you invest in an 85b filter, I don't think it comes with one out of the box.
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#3 Erdwolf_TVL

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 05:51 AM

I would suggest going ahead and doing the S16 mod.

At the moment you are projecting and transfering to SD, but in the future you WILL be transfering to HD... maybe not for another 5 years, but soon it will be more affordable and all your TV's will be HD. Then at that point you'll have the aspect ratio needed on all your older film.

Remember, it makes no difference whether or not you use the S16 frame now, especially if you don't modify the K3 viewfinder because you'll still see the regular 16 frame when shooting. You can keep shooting as you do now, just when you eventually need the extra area it will be there.

If you are projecting, try the Ektachrome 100D. When Kodachrome 16mm is gone that will be your stock, and I think you'll be happy with it. I think its $35 direct from Kodak.

Don't be afraid of negative stocks, especially if you transfer to video... they will blow you away with their quality and latitude. Especially the new Vision2 50D.

Another tip with the K3, make sure you invest in an 85b filter, I don't think it comes with one out of the box.


Thanks for the feedback! Just one question...

So, they don't reallign the viewfinder when going to Super-16?

That could be a problem with artistic shorts / other shots where composition is paramount.

???
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#4 Will Montgomery

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 11:38 AM

Its not entirely necessary to modify the viewfinder, you can kind of guess at what's in the extended area. Du-All camera in NYC will do the viewfinder mod. He can re-cut the mask or remove it altogether. I think it cost around $75-100 to do that, but check with them.

Usually camera techs like to remove the loop formers at the same time to avoid film scratches. Many people say that absolutely has to be done, but it does make it a little more difficult to load the camera. Not too bad once you're used to it, but its not easy. If you've been shooting with the loop formers in place and have no problems, it might not be needed.
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#5 Andy Sparaco SOC

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Posted 12 February 2006 - 03:00 PM

You might take take all of the money you would spend modifying a low cost camera and spend it on film and processing. As you become more proficient and spend more for Xfer the weakness of the camera and optics will become more apparent. Sounds from your post that you are in a "sweetspot" You are enjoying yourself getting results which you are happy with. Super 16 makes sense if you are in a money making part of the business. It is expected for professionals and optional for self finnanced practioners.

Just buy double perf and you will be fine
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#6 Steve Larsen

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Posted 13 February 2006 - 01:06 AM

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Looking for suggestions. I don't know whether it is worth going for Super-16 on my K3. I am an enthusiast. I don't film for money yet. I don't have a Super-16 projector. Most of my work is for 4:3 projection or output to standard video. Plus, I see no need to risk losing a fully working camera...

But the unexposed area of film IS a bit of an eye-sore on the raw stock.

Is the upgrade recommended?



I just bought my first K3 and upgraded it to Super16 myself. After reading through forums and checking out websites I thought I would be able to do it myself but wanted to find a solution for centering the lens and view finder. I took the camera apart enlarged the gate and then stared at it for a few days and came up with the idea of moving the film plane to recenter the lens and viewfinder. You enlarge the gate by 2 mm and lower the film plane by 1 mm to recenter.
first - I moved the s16 gate over by 1 mm
second - The plate the film and sprockets sit's on is 2.5 mm thick aluminum and can be shaved down (after removing all the auto load crap) to move the film down by 1 mm.
third- moving the claw mechanism, I did this by shaving down one side of claw mechanism's connection to it's pivot point by 1mm then added a 1 mm washer to the other side of the pivot point, then added 1 mm washers to the claw mechnism guide to move it over to match the claw.

The camera is all back together now, running smooth, lubed and checked for scratches and everything seems to be ok. I'm shoothing my firt roll now and will post the results when developed.

I highly recommend installing a super16 gate and removing the auto load crap, the camera is pretty easy to load with out it in totall darkness with a little practice and it's one less thing to scratch your film. I would not recommend trying to move the film plane unless you have a good little workshop, accurate measurement tools and are naturally handy.
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Aerial Filmworks

Abel Cine

FJS International, LLC

Willys Widgets

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Paralinx LLC

rebotnix Technologies

Technodolly

CineTape

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Visual Products

Ritter Battery

Opal

Wooden Camera

Metropolis Post

CineLab

Glidecam

The Slider