Jump to content


Photo

Overheads outside


  • Please log in to reply
8 replies to this topic

#1 Michael LaVoie

Michael LaVoie
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 719 posts
  • Cinematographer

Posted 23 February 2006 - 10:26 PM

If I was planning on using a 12x overhead outdoors and I knew that the weather was to be windy that day, at what point should I abandon the idea of the 12x because of safetly concerns. Where is the cutoff? 15mph, 25mph?

I asked the folks at MSE and even they didn't know what the average wind speed limit was for their own frames.

I just want to know to avoid setting it up altogether if it's just going to be a safety hazard.
  • 0

#2 Travis Cline

Travis Cline
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 143 posts
  • Cinematographer

Posted 23 February 2006 - 10:32 PM

12x frames are not too bad in a light breeze. If there is any real wind they can get away from you, but they're not bad if you sandbag your stands and anchor the frame to the ground or something solid on either end. Also, if the wind does pick up and the frame is not going to work for you it takes less than 30 seconds to de-rag your from and then its not really a danger anymore. So you don't have to worry about it if there is not high wind and your grip crew is half way competent.

Travis
  • 0

#3 Gordon Highland

Gordon Highland
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 261 posts
  • Director
  • Kansas City

Posted 23 February 2006 - 10:41 PM

Also, between takes or during high wind speeds, you could spin them 90 degrees so they're parallel with the ground and won't catch much wind. Sort of the opposite with a microphone, you point them straight down in wind to minimize air noise.
  • 0

#4 Jessica Bennett

Jessica Bennett
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 19 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • NY, NY

Posted 24 February 2006 - 03:37 PM

I'm from Miami Beach and now live in NYC. In NYC, its sometimes hard to find something to tie down to on locations, and there are never enough sand bags. Its different when there's a story about Colonel Dave in Miami holding a 12x with one hand over the ocean because the wind has picked up. All I can say is anything's possible. You have to bag and tie down tough always, but I don't give it more than 15 mph for a rag to tear at the grommits or the frame to fold. If you can minimize the strength of the wind against the rag by using it table-topped, then you can equally tie down each corner very well.

Jessica Bennett
Grip
  • 0

#5 Mike Hall

Mike Hall
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 37 posts
  • Gaffer

Posted 12 March 2006 - 12:30 AM

A couple of things should probably govern your use of a 12x12 in wind:

The competence of your crew people, especially your Key Grip. If you have a good key grip, he or she will be able to tell you if flying the 12x12 is a good idea given the conditions; that is, factoring in the shot, available manpower, equipment, time, and location constraints. Since I have read in another forum here that some grips are earning $150/day, I would hasten to add that I would take the advise of a seasoned Grip first. It's my experience that persons new to the grip field may overestimate the ability of the equipment to withstand wind.

If you are in a position to estimate the safety of a 12x12 completely off the cuff, I would recommend that a wind of no more than Beaufort number 5 (Fresh breeze, wind of 19-24mph) in sailing terms be considered. At that windspeed, two grown men of 225lbs should be able to safely handle a 12x12 bagged on high rollers if it is constantly held and "with" the wind.
  • 0

#6 Rupert MacCarthy-Morrogh

Rupert MacCarthy-Morrogh
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 28 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Cork, Ireland

Posted 16 March 2006 - 12:50 PM

If you are in a position to estimate the safety of a 12x12 completely off the cuff, I would recommend that a wind of no more than Beaufort number 5 (Fresh breeze, wind of 19-24mph) in sailing terms be considered. At that windspeed, two grown men of 225lbs should be able to safely handle a 12x12 bagged on high rollers if it is constantly held and "with" the wind.
[/quote]

I'd be wary of putting up 144 sq feet of fabric in a force 5, in theory it could develop 10 -> 15hp of thrust, might not sound like a lot, put think about 5 of those budweiser horses pulling on your sandbags

On my little sail boat the sails generate hell of a lot of power in a force 5, (and it weighs 2 tons)
  • 0

#7 Mike Hall

Mike Hall
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 37 posts
  • Gaffer

Posted 17 March 2006 - 06:26 AM

Since St. Patty's day is opon us, and our Irish Friend has seen fit to call me out, I would like to reiterate my opinion that this is the "outside" edge of where a 12x12 can be flown safely, tabled, or with the wind, by two men. If need be, you have two qualified blokes of 200lbs or more that can handle a little wind, and a 12x12 butterfly in good condition that is tabled(or with) to the wind, I would bet a pint of guiness to all involved in the Tullamore Country Club that I could execute flying it safely and without harm in Beaufort 5 wind any butterfly that can be arranged. I would also hasten to add that there is an extreme difference in the US between "Force" five and "Beaufort" force five, and one might examine the difference before hastening to judgement. I do not know if this is the same in Ireland, however, a 12x12 in a BF 5 wind would still be the dog's bollux. I heart Ireland.

Mike Hall
Glendale, USA
  • 0

#8 Rupert MacCarthy-Morrogh

Rupert MacCarthy-Morrogh
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 28 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Cork, Ireland

Posted 20 March 2006 - 08:46 AM

Ah the joys of the difference between the US and European meaning of "Force five" I thought you were all mad!

;)
And a happy and funnily enoght a very wet and windy St Paddy's week end to you all, and if your ever in Cork I'll buy you that pint, but it will have to be Murphys (Our local stout)
  • 0

#9 Michael Morlan

Michael Morlan
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 212 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Austin, Texas

Posted 15 April 2006 - 08:45 PM

I tried to fly a 12x12 on a rooftop on a day forecast for 16mph winds. When we experienced gusts up to 20-25mph when I told my crew to strike it. That was just too much sail for a sandbagged frame.
  • 0


Willys Widgets

Tai Audio

The Slider

Abel Cine

Aerial Filmworks

CineTape

FJS International, LLC

Wooden Camera

Paralinx LLC

Rig Wheels Passport

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Opal

Visual Products

rebotnix Technologies

Metropolis Post

Glidecam

Broadcast Solutions Inc

CineLab

Technodolly

Ritter Battery

Rig Wheels Passport

The Slider

Abel Cine

Aerial Filmworks

Paralinx LLC

CineTape

Opal

Visual Products

Tai Audio

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Technodolly

FJS International, LLC

Wooden Camera

Broadcast Solutions Inc

CineLab

Glidecam

rebotnix Technologies

Ritter Battery

Metropolis Post

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Willys Widgets