Jump to content


Photo

Krasnogorsk-3 Lenses


  • Please log in to reply
15 replies to this topic

#1 Kirk Anderson

Kirk Anderson
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 220 posts
  • Other

Posted 26 February 2006 - 10:12 PM

I just bought a sweet K-3 and am loving it so far.
here are some questions i have.
1) It came with a zoom lens but i was wondering what other kinds of lenses people have used with sucess. also, where could i pick some up? Do they make a set of Cooke Primes that will fit? doubtful but i might as well ask.

2) I might convert to the Super 16 gate. If i do, how do i project that? I have a Graflex 900 i use for my footage then i shoot it off the wall with a HD cam. Will my projector work with the super 16? I know dumb questions but i'm hesitant about super 16, i just know the final presentation will be worth it.

3) I've heard that it's worth it to remove the loops. Why? and has anyone done this for better results?

I've shot a fair amount of 16 but only with a bolex from my university. I'm ready to shoot my own stuff and dive in head first. Any other suggestions for this Camera? Lenses, fun filters, Film stock preference?
i'm a sponge, so just tell me as much as you can.
thanks
Kirk
  • 0

#2 Will Montgomery

Will Montgomery
  • Sustaining Members
  • 2030 posts
  • Producer
  • Dallas, TX

Posted 27 February 2006 - 11:22 AM

Congrats on the new camera. Do a search on this site and you'll find a ton of info on your K-3.

Here are some observations:

Meter: I've never heard of anyone actually using the K-3 internal meter. Make sure you invest in a good modern light meter made for Cine cameras. You'll be spending alot of money on film, processing and transfer so do your best to expose it correctly. This could cost you as much as $200 or more, but will save you heartache. Modern negative stocks are very forgiving (especially with a good transfer colorist) but nothing helps as much as proper exposure.

Lenses: You're camera should have an M42 mount, sometimes called a Pentax Screw mount. This mount was more popular in Europe than the U.S. so much of what you'll find could come from there. There are many great lenses available, mostly lenses from 35mm still cameras. Search eBay for Pentax Super-Takumar lenses. Its very important that any lens you buy has a FULLY MANUAL APERATURE. The Pentax M42 lenses have switches to make it auto or manual.

Check with local mom & pop camera shops (not a chain store) and you might find some used lenses there too. If you go the Pentax route, a 24mm lens might be a good choice although the 28mm lens is probably easier to find. Also, there are some Russian lenses that are good too like the MC Zenitar 16mm lens or the Peleng 8mm. The 16mm lens is slightly wider than your current lens and would cover the full Super 16 area if you ever make that upgrade. The lens you have is probably pretty good, so try it out in several situations first.

Film: If you are shooting for transfer to video, any of the Vision2 negative stocks are great. 50D if you are outside on a bright day, 250D if its in the shade or not as bright. 100T or 200T would be fine in well-lit interiors. Try some negative B&W stocks. They have more latitude then their reversal film cousins and look great on video transfer... plus the cost less money. Basically you'll be amazed at any film you try; each type has its own unique look.

Super 16: The modification involves making the film gate larger. If you're not a skilled machinist, I suggest having a camera tech like Du-All camera in NYC do it for you. They can remove the loops at the same time; something that reduces the changes of your film being scratched. As far as projecting Super 16, I think you need a projector lens that will handle it.

Transfer: 16mm is not Super 8. While you can project and shoot it off a wall (if you do this shoot reversal stock like Ektachrome), the best methods are to have it transfered by pros like at Bonolabs in MD, Flying Spot Film Transfer in Seattle or CinePost in Atlanta. They aren't the only ones by far, but they are reasonable and do a good job.
  • 0

#3 22west

22west
  • Guests

Posted 27 February 2006 - 12:52 PM

I just bought a sweet K-3 and am loving it so far.
here are some questions i have.
1) It came with a zoom lens but i was wondering what other kinds of lenses people have used with sucess. also, where could i pick some up? Do they make a set of Cooke Primes that will fit? doubtful but i might as well ask.

2) I might convert to the Super 16 gate. If i do, how do i project that? I have a Graflex 900 i use for my footage then i shoot it off the wall with a HD cam. Will my projector work with the super 16? I know dumb questions but i'm hesitant about super 16, i just know the final presentation will be worth it.

3) I've heard that it's worth it to remove the loops. Why? and has anyone done this for better results?

I've shot a fair amount of 16 but only with a bolex from my university. I'm ready to shoot my own stuff and dive in head first. Any other suggestions for this Camera? Lenses, fun filters, Film stock preference?
i'm a sponge, so just tell me as much as you can.
thanks
Kirk


Some more info :

1) The lenses commonly put on this camera are shown here : http://www.geocities...asnogorsk-3.htm

2) When the gate is opened up for s16 the lense then becomes laterally off center with the frame - as a result you cannot zoom or pull focus without seeing a strange effect. As long as you don't zoom or pull focus its fine.

3) Alot of people have complained about the loops and alot of people have not - I believe its because the production quality in these units is all over the place. My K3 runs fine with the loops still installed. IMHO if the loops are not causing you trouble, leave them in.

Some users have attached lipstick cameras to the eyepiece in order to do steadycam work.

There was a crystal sync motor modification done by these guys : http://www.k3camera.com/k3/k3motor.stm
...but they don't do it anymore :( .

I don't use the internal lightmeter I use a handheld one.

Its clearly too loud for sync sound (perhaps 60-70 db) and I have not heard of anyone coming up with a barney for it.

This is a great camera to start out with or use as a second unit MOS camera.

I've shot Vision2 200T with it and had some nice results - check some of my posts.
I am waiting to get back some 500T in the next week.
  • 0

#4 eggart

eggart
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 12 posts
  • Other

Posted 02 March 2006 - 07:08 PM

Is there a specific adapter that would allow me to use c-mount lenses on my m42 K3?
  • 0

#5 Ian Marks

Ian Marks
  • Guests

Posted 02 March 2006 - 07:38 PM

I don't think that you can put C-mount lenses on your K3 - the flange to focal plane distance is all wrong, and the camera's mirror/shutter would be in the way.

I think.
  • 0

#6 Steve Larsen

Steve Larsen
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Grip
  • Vancouver, BC, Canada

Posted 02 March 2006 - 09:16 PM

Some more info :

2) When the gate is opened up for s16 the lense then becomes laterally off center with the frame - as a result you cannot zoom or pull focus without seeing a strange effect. As long as you don't zoom or pull focus its fine.

I found away around this problem it's described in my post:
http://www.cinematog...showtopic=12111
  • 0

#7 Charles MacDonald

Charles MacDonald
  • Sustaining Members
  • 1157 posts
  • Other
  • Stittsville Ontario Canada

Posted 02 March 2006 - 09:26 PM

I don't think that you can put C-mount lenses on your K3 - the flange to focal plane distance is all wrong, and the camera's mirror/shutter would be in the way.

The M-42 lens mount was designed for a 35mm SLR still camera originaly, and I think the lens to film distance is about twice the c mount distance.

Someone with a lathe could make you an adaptor, but you could only photograph rather extreme close ups.
  • 0

#8 Leo Anthony Vale

Leo Anthony Vale
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 2010 posts
  • Other
  • Pittsburgh PA

Posted 03 March 2006 - 01:25 PM

The M-42 lens mount was designed for a 35mm SLR still camera originaly, and I think the lens to film distance is about twice the c mount distance.

Someone with a lathe could make you an adaptor, but you could only photograph rather extreme close ups.


---17.52mm vs. 45.5mm. So getting closer to 3X.

Such adaptors would be for micro photography, rather than mere macro.

---LV
  • 0

#9 Chris Burke

Chris Burke
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1675 posts
  • Boston, MA

Posted 03 March 2006 - 06:32 PM

I just bought a sweet K-3 and am loving it so far.
here are some questions i have.
1) It came with a zoom lens but i was wondering what other kinds of lenses people have used with sucess. also, where could i pick some up? Do they make a set of Cooke Primes that will fit? doubtful but i might as well ask.

2) I might convert to the Super 16 gate. If i do, how do i project that? I have a Graflex 900 i use for my footage then i shoot it off the wall with a HD cam. Will my projector work with the super 16? I know dumb questions but i'm hesitant about super 16, i just know the final presentation will be worth it.

3) I've heard that it's worth it to remove the loops. Why? and has anyone done this for better results?

I've shot a fair amount of 16 but only with a bolex from my university. I'm ready to shoot my own stuff and dive in head first. Any other suggestions for this Camera? Lenses, fun filters, Film stock preference?
i'm a sponge, so just tell me as much as you can.
thanks
Kirk


I have owned several K-3's and the only real drawback is the lack of wide lenses. Yes there is the Peleng 8mm, but I here mixed results from this. I do here that there is a way to put a Nikon mount on the camera. Whether this is worth while, I don't know. But there are a lot of Nikon lenses out there.

Chris
  • 0

#10 Will Montgomery

Will Montgomery
  • Sustaining Members
  • 2030 posts
  • Producer
  • Dallas, TX

Posted 03 March 2006 - 08:57 PM

I have owned several K-3's and the only real drawback is the lack of wide lenses. Yes there is the Peleng 8mm, but I here mixed results from this.


The Peleng is a pretty extreme lens, although on a 16mm camera its not quite a fisheye. For certain applications it can be cool.

The MC Zenitar 16mm lens works great for width, although I'm not completely sold on the quality of the glass. There is very little curvature on the edges and covers the entire S16 frame. Since the stock K-3 lens goes to 17mm, this is slightly wider but covers the entire frame. For about $150 new, not a bad deal.
  • 0

#11 Ole Dost

Ole Dost
  • Guests

Posted 04 March 2006 - 05:09 AM

Concerning the lens question: The M42 system allows to use many diferent lenses -most of them very cheap. There are also a lot of adapters, that help you to use any SLR-lens. I got an adapter Canon FD - M42 . I´m able to use my SLR-Canon-Lenses on the K 3 now.
One of the best SLR-lenses I know was designed for M42. Try to get it! It is availible very cheap. It´s the Pentacon 1:1,8 50mm. It was produced during the eighties in Dresden, East Germany, for the SLR-Camera Practica (MTL 3, MTL 5 etc). Try to get one of these SLR-Cameras (on Ebay for example -supposed to be very cheap), take off the Pentacon 1:1,8 50mm lens and put it on your K3. I never had a lens with this sharpness and contrast. And I´ve ben using lots of lenses from Canon -also different 50mm lenses (like the FD 1.1,8 and 1:1,2) -none of the Canon lenses was like the Pentacon lens.
Best regards,
Ole
  • 0

#12 Leo Anthony Vale

Leo Anthony Vale
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 2010 posts
  • Other
  • Pittsburgh PA

Posted 04 March 2006 - 01:47 PM

Concerning the lens question: The M42 system allows to use many diferent lenses -most of them very cheap. There are also a lot of adapters, that help you to use any SLR-lens. I got an adapter Canon FD - M42 . I´m able to use my SLR-Canon-Lenses on the K 3 now.


---Have you actually used that adaptor yet?

The FD mount is considerably wider than the M-42 and has a shorter flange depth.
If it's really for using Canons on an M-42, it would be for macro work.
Whereas Canon did make an adaptor for using m-42 lenses on an FD.
Many other cameras have adaptors for using M-42s on them. Nikon and Contax/Yashica are examples.
But as for using other mounts on an M-42...

---LV
  • 0

#13 Trevor Greenfield

Trevor Greenfield
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 162 posts
  • Director
  • North Idaho

Posted 05 March 2006 - 03:43 AM

Concerning the lens question: The M42 system allows to use many diferent lenses -most of them very cheap. There are also a lot of adapters, that help you to use any SLR-lens. I got an adapter Canon FD - M42 . I´m able to use my SLR-Canon-Lenses on the K 3 now.
One of the best SLR-lenses I know was designed for M42. Try to get it! It is availible very cheap. It´s the Pentacon 1:1,8 50mm. It was produced during the eighties in Dresden, East Germany, for the SLR-Camera Practica (MTL 3, MTL 5 etc). Try to get one of these SLR-Cameras (on Ebay for example -supposed to be very cheap), take off the Pentacon 1:1,8 50mm lens and put it on your K3. I never had a lens with this sharpness and contrast. And I´ve ben using lots of lenses from Canon -also different 50mm lenses (like the FD 1.1,8 and 1:1,2) -none of the Canon lenses was like the Pentacon lens.
Best regards,
Ole


1.8 is great but isnt 50mm the equiv. of a 100mm telephoto for 16mm on the k3? Thats kind of tough to find use with in most situations, but certainly it would be a good addition to the arsenal.

....


Personally I've shot a bit of footage with the stock zoom lens and I like the quality but yes.. it is cheap. And whatever you do don't leave the screw on lever on the zoom control if you don't want to zoom during a shot! That thing will move on you (I found out the hard way).
  • 0

#14 Philippe Lignieres

Philippe Lignieres
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 62 posts
  • Director

Posted 05 March 2006 - 11:17 AM

I have owned several K-3's and the only real drawback is the lack of wide lenses. Yes there is the Peleng 8mm, but I here mixed results from this. I do here that there is a way to put a Nikon mount on the camera. Whether this is worth while, I don't know. But there are a lot of Nikon lenses out there.

Chris

One thing I never read here is to use the special 0,75 wide converter (made for 10/100mm zoom for Kinor) on a 17/69 meteor for K-3.
I made it quickly a few days ago, just putting it on the front lens with a little bit of gaffer. It seems it work fine. I just looked in the viewfinder, not seen the result on film. The minimal focus distance seem to be around one meter, so half the usual distance and all look as a 12,5mm.
Anyway, sharpness is less than normal lens, so anybody could know...
  • 0

#15 eggart

eggart
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 12 posts
  • Other

Posted 05 March 2006 - 11:34 AM

I've been thinking of trying to shoot through one of those convex security mirrors to acheive a faux-wide-angle look. Has anybody tried this?
  • 0

#16 Ole Dost

Ole Dost
  • Guests

Posted 05 March 2006 - 02:34 PM

1.8 is great but isnt 50mm the equiv. of a 100mm telephoto for 16mm on the k3? Thats kind of tough to find use with in most situations, but certainly it would be a good addition to the arsenal.

....
Personally I've shot a bit of footage with the stock zoom lens and I like the quality but yes.. it is cheap. And whatever you do don't leave the screw on lever on the zoom control if you don't want to zoom during a shot! That thing will move on you (I found out the hard way).



Of course, 50mm is telephoto on the 16mm formate. But if you need a moderate telephoto lens -the Pentacon lens is a great choice. I for myself, I love to pick up details. That´s why I´m often using telephoto-lenses.
  • 0


Opal

Rig Wheels Passport

The Slider

FJS International, LLC

Technodolly

Paralinx LLC

Wooden Camera

Metropolis Post

Ritter Battery

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

CineTape

CineLab

Willys Widgets

Glidecam

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Aerial Filmworks

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Visual Products

rebotnix Technologies

Tai Audio

Abel Cine

FJS International, LLC

Opal

Rig Wheels Passport

Glidecam

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Technodolly

rebotnix Technologies

Metropolis Post

CineTape

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Ritter Battery

CineLab

Tai Audio

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

The Slider

Willys Widgets

Wooden Camera

Abel Cine

Visual Products

Aerial Filmworks

Paralinx LLC