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Db levels for sound sync


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#1 James Steven Beverly

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 09:50 PM

What are the highest Db levels that wouldbe concidered acceptable for shooting close up sound sync?
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#2 Hal Smith

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 10:54 PM

What are the highest Db levels that wouldbe concidered acceptable for shooting close up sound sync?

A lot depends on what equipment is in use, analog tape recorders overload very gracefully, they "blow out" very smoothly, that's why "old school" pros use Nagras. When overdriven to +3dB or more they still produce usable recording (the tech that sets up the bias level on a given analog recorder can overbias about 1dB or so which trades a bit of playback output for a more forgiving overload characteristic). Digital's an entirely different story, +1dB past maximum recording level and you've got trash. I generally try to keep digital peaks at about -6db to avoid having the peak from h**l crunch the recording. Keep in mind a good, raspy male voice has instantaneous peaks 10db and more over the average level. An analog recorder will have no problem with those peaks (within reason) but many a digital recording will turn those peaks into trash.

That's the skinny from a studio recordist - Captain might like to hear some BTDT experience from some location recordists. Chime in guys, you won't hurt my feelings (okay, you will but I'm a big boy, I can take it).
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#3 Michael Nash

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 10:56 PM

I'm not sure what you mean -- the decibels (loudness or volume) of the sound source, or the input levels on the recording device? Or are you asking how loud can the camera be when it's close to the action, and still record clean dialogue?

Nominal input level for digital recording is -20 dB (sometimes -12 dB); 0dB for analogue recording.

The sound source can be any volume (decibel level), as long as the input level is brought down to keep it from "peaking."

A camera is too loud if the sound recordist can hear it through good isolating headphones while monitoring the dialogue. There are post tools that can do a decent job of removing excess camera noise, but at that point the camera is really still too loud.

http://www.kenstone....udio_peaks.html
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#4 Chris Keth

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Posted 12 June 2006 - 11:24 AM

I think he means how loud a camera is still acceptable for sync production. Most sync cameras hover around the 20db level, but the SR3 is more like 24db and still fine. I've even used an a-minima (rated at 28db, I think) and in all but the closest-to-the-mic situations it was just fine.
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#5 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 13 June 2006 - 01:07 AM

What are the highest Db levels that wouldbe concidered acceptable for shooting close up sound sync?


The russian 35 mm cine cameras for sync sound shooting have :
Kinor-35S - 28 Db
Kinor-35H - 32 Db
Era-2COS - 26 Db
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#6 James Steven Beverly

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Posted 13 June 2006 - 01:21 AM

Yeah, that's exactly what I meant although the sound recording info will also be very useful during production as well. I am looking at buying a Kinor 35 eather a H or C, whatevery I can get the best deal on and they seem to run at about 32db (unless i've been misinformed) which is a little loud but within a the range for a blimp. I really like these camera a lot especially for what they cost and know the Russians have used them with great success.
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#7 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 14 June 2006 - 04:10 AM

Yeah, that's exactly what I meant although the sound recording info will also be very useful during production as well. I am looking at buying a Kinor 35 eather a H or C, whatevery I can get the best deal on and they seem to run at about 32db (unless i've been misinformed) which is a little loud but within a the range for a blimp. I really like these camera a lot especially for what they cost and know the Russians have used them with great success.


Kinor-35S ( C ) have more big body with more sound protection, that's why, S have 28 Db.
Kinor-35H have more modern view of body, less size and weight and 32 Db.
The many user of Kinor-35 set new modern microprocessor control with multi speed crystal sync control.
Kinor have many accessories, base plate with rods, follow focus, video assistance, 150 m, 300 m film magazines, normal and anamoprhic sets of lens hoods, wide set of film gates and ground glasses.

Frankly speaking, the many fiction films use technology of dubbing of sound tack on professional sound recoding studio, that's why, can be use cameras with big volume of noise ( like Arri 435).
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#8 James Steven Beverly

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Posted 14 June 2006 - 02:49 PM

at 32 dbs I think a barney w/ optical glass in front of the lens will quiet it down to practically nothing so I'm sur it will be fine. I like these cameras a lot. The Russians have a great genius for building equipment that is practical and sturdy. Though it might not have all the bells and whiistles a Moviecam has, for the differnce in price I can live w/out the bells and whistles. B)
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