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ND for windows


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#1 Lars.Erik

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 07:52 AM

Hey everyone,

I'm doing a 5-week shoot in July/August. And need to gel several windows. I don't want to use ordinary ND and water, since this won't last. I want it to stick.

I've used CTO with glue previously, but I want 5600K interior. So I need to use ND on the windows, ranging from 0.6 to 1.2. Do Lee or Roscoe make ND with glue? If they do, do they have a special name to it. Need to order. I suspect these filters will cost a lot more, but willing to pay that price.

Worst case scenario, I'll staple ND to the window frames.


LE

Edited by Lars.Erik, 29 May 2006 - 07:53 AM.

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#2 timHealy

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 08:50 AM

hello Lars,

You weren't really clear, but if you are shooting at that one location for 5 weeks you may want to invest in hard ND gels that typically come in 4 foot by 8 foot sheets. They are a bit expensive, but once you have a bunch of it cut to the size of your windows, they can be switched/removed very easily and will never, ever have to worry about them flopping around ruining sound takes and timely applications using water and such.

And typically they can be applied with velcro around the edges of the sheets. If you can convince them to spend the extra money before hand, they will save time and energy during shooting.

best

Tim

PS rereading your question: I am not sure about Rosco or Lee, but I do know that Gam makes gels with an adhesive backing. Not sure of the prices though.

Edited by heel_e, 29 May 2006 - 08:52 AM.

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#3 Lars.Erik

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 08:58 AM

Hey Tim, thanks for your reply.

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear on my last post. I'm basically looking into getting ND with glue on them to attach to windows.

What kind of gel is hard ND? Is it just ND that's hard?


LE
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#4 Jon Rosenbloom

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 11:08 AM

Hard nd is 1/4" thick plastic and comes in the usual flavors .3, .6, .9, 1.2. It's best to cut it on a table saw. You can use a jig on it, just make sure to use a blade for cutting plastic. If you're using soft gels, the industry standard of the moment is to "frame" the glass w/ 1/2" clear double-stick tape and then apply the gel, working the wrinkles from the center out to the edges.
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#5 Laurent Andrieux

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 02:38 PM

I don't know about hard gels but I have applied regular gel on windows, just by damping them with aspong that works great no need for glue.

Never tested it for several weeks, actually.

You also can think of using scrim. I think they stand water pretty well.

I was shooting the press junket for "Over the Hedge" during Cannes festival the other day and we were shooting at the Eden Roc in Cap d'Antibes close to the sea border. It was hard wind that day... Bruce Willis got soaked actually, but the scrim stayed nice. The only point was the salt that was leaving white marks on it, we just wipped it off. Only took a couple of minutes...
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#6 Michael Nash

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 04:45 PM

I was shooting the press junket for "Over the Hedge" during Cannes festival the other day and we were shooting at the Eden Roc in Cap d'Antibes close to the sea border. It was hard wind that day... Bruce Willis got soaked actually, but the scrim stayed nice. The only point was the salt that was leaving white marks on it, we just wipped it off. Only took a couple of minutes...


That was you? ;)
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#7 Laurent Andrieux

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 05:43 PM

We were many operators on this shot... ;)
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#8 timHealy

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 09:56 PM

I don't know about hard gels but I have applied regular gel on windows, just by damping them with aspong that works great no need for glue.


The thing about hard gels that make them benficial are the speed at which one can change them or take them off (if they have been pre cut by your rigging grips) and you have a lot of windows like an office building set in a real location. Have you ever wanted to change ND in between takes let alone in between shots? The second thing is that they won't flap in the wind on sound takes. Two issues normal gel on rolls will have.

If you only have a window or two that you are working with it is not much of a big deal.

The choice is yours. One has to balance budget with the realities of your set. I know I cringe everytime I am shooting and hear gels blowing in the wind.

Best

Tim
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#9 Bob Hayes

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 10:36 PM

Here is a wonderful product by Great American Market. I?ve used it on car windows with great success. Even allowing me to roll the window down in the shot. http://www.gamonline.com/

I do however have to agree with other posts. Once you stick ND on windows you?re committing yourself to the ND. What do you do if you have an overcast day or end up shooting into the afternoon? I am often pull and then adding NDs to the windows during the day. Rosco makes a great material which is a black scrim called Rosco scrim that often works well.
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#10 Michael Nash

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Posted 30 May 2006 - 02:32 AM

Here is a wonderful product by Great American Market. I?ve used it on car windows with great success. Even allowing me to roll the window down in the shot. http://www.gamonline.com/


Sorry Bob your link just takes us to GAM's main page. I'd love to see what product you're referring to.
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#11 Laurent Andrieux

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Posted 30 May 2006 - 04:27 AM

When the gel is damped with a sponge and applied to the window it doesn't move anymore... No need for glue. Water is enough.

Rosco makes a great material which is a black scrim called Rosco scrim that often works well.


This is what I was talking about...
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#12 Bob Hayes

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Posted 30 May 2006 - 10:54 AM

Sorry Bob your link just takes us to GAM's main page. I'd love to see what product you're referring to.


It's called window grip. It is adhesive backed.
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#13 Lars.Erik

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Posted 30 May 2006 - 11:54 AM

When the gel is damped with a sponge and applied to the window it doesn't move anymore... No need for glue. Water is enough.
This is what I was talking about...



I'm sorry, but I have found this not to be correct. At least it hasn't worked for me. And I have put ND on quite a few windows. If just for a day or two, yes, then water is a good thing. But when it's for several weeks, it doesn't work. The reason for this is that the water evaporates. Specially in summer time when it's warm.

LE
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#14 oscar jimenez

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Posted 30 May 2006 - 12:27 PM

WHY DONT TRY CAR WINDOW FILM ND PAPER? I HAVE USED IT AND TI IS OK, THERE ARE SOME THAT DONT CONTAIN COLOR AT ALL.
JUST AN IDEA
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#15 Laurent Andrieux

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Posted 30 May 2006 - 04:41 PM

I'm sorry, but I have found this not to be correct. At least it hasn't worked for me. And I have put ND on quite a few windows. If just for a day or two, yes, then water is a good thing. But when it's for several weeks, it doesn't work. The reason for this is that the water evaporates. Specially in summer time when it's warm.

LE


I mentionned the fact I didn't try that for several weeks. Thanks, then, to let us know it doesn't work for a long time.
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