Jump to content


Photo

When will price drop?


  • Please log in to reply
10 replies to this topic

#1 Drew Ott

Drew Ott
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 29 posts
  • Student
  • Austin, TX

Posted 03 June 2006 - 03:20 PM

New to the forums, but when do you think that the price will begin going down?

Is there a new camera suspected to make this price drop a little bit, or is it here to stay at around $6,000 for another few years?

Sorry for the amateur question




Drew Ott
  • 0

#2 Stephen Williams

Stephen Williams
  • Sustaining Members
  • 4708 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Europe

Posted 03 June 2006 - 03:48 PM

New to the forums, but when do you think that the price will begin going down?

Is there a new camera suspected to make this price drop a little bit, or is it here to stay at around $6,000 for another few years?

Sorry for the amateur question
Drew Ott


Hi,

If you are worried about the price falling in the next few years I don't think you should buy a video camera. It's not a long term investment.

You should think of renting a camera when you have a job.

Just my 2c

Stephen
  • 0

#3 Drew Ott

Drew Ott
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 29 posts
  • Student
  • Austin, TX

Posted 03 June 2006 - 04:24 PM

Hi,

If you are worried about the price falling in the next few years I don't think you should buy a video camera. It's not a long term investment.

You should think of renting a camera when you have a job.

Just my 2c

Stephen


I'm 15 right now, and my parents are willing to help me out buying a camera up to about $4,000 because I plan on going to film school and they are considering it part of my education. By saying that I am 15, I am in no way stating that I am just going through that "director" stage in my life, that a lot of kids do in boards like this. I've been studying film since about 11, and my parents can see how dedicated I am (they're incredibly tight with money).

I realize $6,000 is a whole lot of money to start off at, but if I'm going to have this camera for a long time I think HD is the way to go. I also want 24p for the "film look". This camera is the most affordable with both of those formats.

Any clue on when the price may drop?

Edited by Drew Ott, 03 June 2006 - 04:25 PM.

  • 0

#4 Scott Fritzshall

Scott Fritzshall
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 584 posts
  • Other
  • Los Angeles

Posted 03 June 2006 - 04:49 PM

I'm 15 right now, and my parents are willing to help me out buying a camera up to about $4,000 because I plan on going to film school and they are considering it part of my education. By saying that I am 15, I am in no way stating that I am just going through that "director" stage in my life, that a lot of kids do in boards like this. I've been studying film since about 11, and my parents can see how dedicated I am (they're incredibly tight with money).

I realize $6,000 is a whole lot of money to start off at, but if I'm going to have this camera for a long time I think HD is the way to go. I also want 24p for the "film look". This camera is the most affordable with both of those formats.

Any clue on when the price may drop?

You need to buy not only the camera, but also the memory cards for it, and a tripod, and accessories, and probably lights and whatnot. It all adds up to way more than just $6000.

It's really difficult to recommend buying any prosumer camera as an investment right now, since the market is moving so quickly. You're paying thousands of dollars, and as you say will hang on to it for several years, but in a year or two you'll be dying to replace it. Anything you buy now will be outdated pretty quick.

When you get to film school, they'll probably have their own cameras there. In the meantime, I'd personally recommend buying something inexpensive. Find a decent 3CCD miniDV camera with as many manual controls as you can, and a decent tripod, and put the rest of the money into making films. Also, try calling up local rental houses. If you explain to them that you're a high school kid and that you're really interested in filmmaking but don't have a lot of money, they may be willing to give you discounts on renting equipment. That way you may be able to get access to better cameras.

Or, as another option, put the money into a cheap 16mm camera and buying film. If you came to film school with a couple years of experience shooting actual film, you'd have a pretty big advantage, in my opinion.

Really though, there's nothing about filmmaking a high school student can learn with an HVX200 that you can't learn with a cheap miniDV camera. I know you want your movies to look good, but I can pretty much promise you that you'll be too embarassed to show them to people by the time you get into college. I'm not putting you down at all; just relating my experience with it.
  • 0

#5 Drew Ott

Drew Ott
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 29 posts
  • Student
  • Austin, TX

Posted 03 June 2006 - 06:43 PM

You need to buy not only the camera, but also the memory cards for it, and a tripod, and accessories, and probably lights and whatnot. It all adds up to way more than just $6000.

It's really difficult to recommend buying any prosumer camera as an investment right now, since the market is moving so quickly. You're paying thousands of dollars, and as you say will hang on to it for several years, but in a year or two you'll be dying to replace it. Anything you buy now will be outdated pretty quick.

When you get to film school, they'll probably have their own cameras there. In the meantime, I'd personally recommend buying something inexpensive. Find a decent 3CCD miniDV camera with as many manual controls as you can, and a decent tripod, and put the rest of the money into making films. Also, try calling up local rental houses. If you explain to them that you're a high school kid and that you're really interested in filmmaking but don't have a lot of money, they may be willing to give you discounts on renting equipment. That way you may be able to get access to better cameras.

Or, as another option, put the money into a cheap 16mm camera and buying film. If you came to film school with a couple years of experience shooting actual film, you'd have a pretty big advantage, in my opinion.

Really though, there's nothing about filmmaking a high school student can learn with an HVX200 that you can't learn with a cheap miniDV camera. I know you want your movies to look good, but I can pretty much promise you that you'll be too embarassed to show them to people by the time you get into college. I'm not putting you down at all; just relating my experience with it.



I guess you're right. I've sort of been doubting myself along the way this whole time about whether or not it was really worth it. 16mm seems fun but incredibly hard to learn. I guess I'm going to check that out.

The only thing about renting equipment, is the fact that once I pay the money and my time is up, all the equipment is gone and I have the chance to be left with bad footage. Also: if I rent equipment, it would take atleast a couple of days to learn how to use it properly. This would all be costing me money, too.

I'm going to start researching 16mm film, etc. I plan on entering some contests coming up, so that's why I thought I needed a good camera relatively soon.

Thanks for your helpful poost.
  • 0

#6 David Sweetman

David Sweetman
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 757 posts
  • Student

Posted 03 June 2006 - 06:59 PM

Well, if unemployment increases, the price might drop a little, considering inflation and unemployment vary inversely. If we don't hit stagflation, that is. Of course, our country's doing so much spending now that I don't think we'll enter a deflationary gap anytime soon.

Anyway, yeah, I'd second the 3CCD idea, that'll give you plenty of resolution for your purposes. Heck I made it through the same stage with a 1ccd.

16mm is great, & way better than HD in my opinion, but it might not be the best for you at this point, on account of all the extra planning, setup and workflow steps involved - you want to just get out and shoot as much stuff as possible.

If you don't have Avid - then for students, this is the best place ever:
http://www.journeyed...182546 S6 Y1699

that's where I got my copy, it's like 90% off retail.
  • 0

#7 Stephen Williams

Stephen Williams
  • Sustaining Members
  • 4708 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Europe

Posted 04 June 2006 - 03:56 AM

I'm 15 right now, and my parents are willing to help me out buying a camera up to about $4,000 because I plan on going to film school and they are considering it part of my education. By saying that I am 15, I am in no way stating that I am just going through that "director" stage in my life, that a lot of kids do in boards like this. I've been studying film since about 11, and my parents can see how dedicated I am (they're incredibly tight with money).

I realize $6,000 is a whole lot of money to start off at, but if I'm going to have this camera for a long time I think HD is the way to go. I also want 24p for the "film look". This camera is the most affordable with both of those formats.

Any clue on when the price may drop?


Hi,

Equipment developement is happening so fast I would wait. Video cameras are only 'cool' for a very short period of time. Save your parents money, its hard in this business to earn an 'extra' $6000 after tax. You won't understand that now, in 10 years time you will!

For learning a used DV camera will serve you well IMHO.

Stephen
  • 0

#8 Brian Drysdale

Brian Drysdale
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 5070 posts
  • Cinematographer

Posted 04 June 2006 - 05:04 AM

Remember you'll need funds to actually make the films. You'll also need a good tripod and some basic lights. Shooting on MiniDV is a good starting point.

A point to remember is that quite a lot of people own the HDV cameras, but only shoot MiniDV.

If you want to shoot HDV progressive, you should also consider the JVC HD 100. The layout is similar to the high end professional cameras, so it's good camera to learn your basic skills. You can see tests comparing the two cameras in the JVC HD 100 threads.
  • 0

#9 Drew Ott

Drew Ott
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 29 posts
  • Student
  • Austin, TX

Posted 04 June 2006 - 02:10 PM

Remember you'll need funds to actually make the films. You'll also need a good tripod and some basic lights. Shooting on MiniDV is a good starting point.

A point to remember is that quite a lot of people own the HDV cameras, but only shoot MiniDV.

If you want to shoot HDV progressive, you should also consider the JVC HD 100. The layout is similar to the high end professional cameras, so it's good camera to learn your basic skills. You can see tests comparing the two cameras in the JVC HD 100 threads.


I guess I'm just going to wait. Every time I lean towards film, I am told to go back to DV, etc.

I agree that the market is moving too fast to spend all my money on a camera.

BTW, my parents are not movie-makers. Someone implied that they thought that. Thanks everybody for making my decision a little bit harder. What about the DVX100b?
  • 0

#10 Phil Aupperle

Phil Aupperle
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Director
  • Brooklyn, New York

Posted 12 June 2006 - 01:45 PM

I went to film school at NYU, and I have an HVX. In my opinion, you don't need either to be a successful filmmaker. Both cost a lot of money, and you're probably better off spending that on your films, imo. Get a decent firewire DV camera (save by getting a used one), a Mac with Final Cut (or a PC with Premiere if you must [shudder]), a mic, an inexpensive tripod with a fluid head, a couple of lights if you want, a copy of Final Draft, and maybe a Netflix account. Then check out some books like Film Directing, Cinematic Motion; and Film Directing, Shot by Shot. Go to the library. Watch the classics and pick them apart with the pause button.

Learn how to tell stories through WRITING, ACTING and EDITING. Do loads of experiments, try doing the same scene three different ways. Try different genres. People get too hung up on the tech side of filmmaking, and it really more about ideas, people, style, emotions, design, choices.

Maybe it's not as sexy as getting the hot camera (and yes, the HVX is sweet) but you'll know that your training yourself in fundamentals rather than just throwing money at a tool. You have to be like a KungFu disciple and become unstoppable by punching a bag of rice 5000 times a day.

Shooting 16 is a huge waste of money at your stage. If you have that kind of money to burn you should put it in a retirement fund, not give it to the lab. If you want to learn how to shoot film, shoot 35mm stills. Shoot tests. Try differnt film stocks. Bracket your exposures, play with depth of field, shoot narratives using stills. (this is what they make you do at NYU ayway)

If you want to be a cinematographer, try to get a job as an apprentice in a camera dept. I don't know if people are making films where you live, but there are always people looking for free or cheap help in indy projects. You'll learn more about what to do and what not to do on a few sets than you will in a semester of film school, trust me.

Here's a money saving tip that it took me way too long to learn: You'll get more production value from a couple of good looking actors than from a good shot any day. You can film a beautiful actor with a crappy camera and she's still beautiful. You can film a ho-hum looking actor with the most elaborate set up, and they won't look much better than ho-hum. Why do you think movie stars are more attractive than average?
  • 0

#11 Eduardo Bunster

Eduardo Bunster

    New

  • Basic Members
  • Pip
  • 5 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Santiago, Chile

Posted 19 June 2006 - 04:27 PM

Thanks everybody for making my decision a little bit harder. What about the DVX100b?


Hi, I go trough the same decision some time ago.

My advice: buy a used 3CCD camera, the Panasonic DVX100 being the best in my opinion, a little fragile but has a great optic (Leica) and manual controls. You´ll also need a reasonably good tripod with a fluid head (for example Manfrotto legs 074, 503 head) + computer with editing software (FinalCut or Premier)
Forget about buying lights in your earlier period, learn the language of film making first. With each new film that you make, you´ll get more and more aware about lighting, set designing, sound, etc. Then you can start buying other stuff.

Hope this helps

Eduardo Bunster
  • 0


Visual Products

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

FJS International, LLC

Broadcast Solutions Inc

CineLab

The Slider

Aerial Filmworks

Metropolis Post

CineTape

Opal

Paralinx LLC

Ritter Battery

Tai Audio

Glidecam

Willys Widgets

Wooden Camera

Abel Cine

rebotnix Technologies

Rig Wheels Passport

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Technodolly

rebotnix Technologies

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Willys Widgets

Ritter Battery

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Tai Audio

Aerial Filmworks

Visual Products

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Paralinx LLC

Rig Wheels Passport

FJS International, LLC

Abel Cine

The Slider

CineLab

Metropolis Post

Glidecam

CineTape

Wooden Camera

Technodolly

Opal