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THE GRIP CHALLENGE


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#1 peter kantor

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 06:43 AM

Does anyone know ..
if the furniture clamp adapter is also called 90 degree pin (if so what part of the world?)
if the math boom is known by a different name, baby boom perhaps?
where the term beaver board for a pigeon on a pancake originated?
If diffusion goes after or before the gel on the barndoors and why
any specific terms for effect created on light being cast i.e.;topper, bottomer, sider, others?
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#2 Tshaka

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Posted 03 August 2006 - 08:26 PM

Are you taking some kind of a test?

Tshaka
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#3 Tim O'Connor

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Posted 03 August 2006 - 11:25 PM

Does anyone know ..
if the furniture clamp adapter is also called 90 degree pin (if so what part of the world?)
if the math boom is known by a different name, baby boom perhaps?
where the term beaver board for a pigeon on a pancake originated?
If diffusion goes after or before the gel on the barndoors and why
any specific terms for effect created on light being cast i.e.;topper, bottomer, sider, others?


I'd like to hear if people have any thoughts on the diffusion/gel order of placement. If you consider the
difference between diffusion on the barndoors vs. diffusion on a frame or a chimera or something; there's
a difference but could moving it a 1/16 (I guess) of an inch matter or whther you put it before or after
gel?
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#4 Chris Keth

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Posted 03 August 2006 - 11:49 PM

I'd like to hear if people have any thoughts on the diffusion/gel order of placement. If you consider the
difference between diffusion on the barndoors vs. diffusion on a frame or a chimera or something; there's
a difference but could moving it a 1/16 (I guess) of an inch matter or whther you put it before or after
gel?



Bah. There's absolutely no physical reason why order would matter. The only reason I can think of where it might matter if if you're into using tracing paper for diffusion. Then, I suppose, you could use the gel as a sort of heat shield for the paper, though it probably wouldn't work all that well.
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#5 Hal Smith

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Posted 04 August 2006 - 12:01 AM

where the term beaver board for a pigeon on a pancake originated?

"Beaver" is US truck driver slang for a woman. I think you can figure the rest out for yourself.
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#6 Patrick McGowan

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Posted 04 August 2006 - 12:37 AM

Always use protection when putting the pancake pigeon in the beaver board.
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#7 peter kantor

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Posted 04 August 2006 - 08:35 AM

no test, I enjoy the trivia behind the gear that I use
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#8 peter kantor

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Posted 04 August 2006 - 08:49 AM

are there any seasoned G&E out there?

gel first then diffusion, or diffusion then gel.. I know that I was corrected on this once and given a plausable reason, but I don't remember what!

do you really think beaver board comes from a sexual "position"?

I'll check with matthews on the 90 degree pin question
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#9 Chris Walker

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Posted 04 August 2006 - 11:27 AM

I've always been told color first then diffusion. I don't know why though.
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#10 Tshaka

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Posted 05 August 2006 - 03:45 AM

no test, I enjoy the trivia behind the gear that I use


Okay. Fair enough.

Matthews' Furniture Clamp Adapter is also called a 90ยบ pin here in New York and on the West Coast and Florida.

The thing about Matthews is that they are one of many great Manufacturers of Grip Equipment. They may have their own unique name for a common piece of grip gear. This doesn't mean that they invented that particular piece of gear nor does it mean that they are the only ones who make it. It just means they have their own version of it with clever Matthews nomenclature.

So the Math Boom covers a type of stand Matthews makes which includes the Baby Boom, Junior Boom and Mini Boom.

The Boom concept in this case describes an offset which allows us to suspend an object, in this case a light, just outside of the picture frame. The Sound department uses a Boom Microphone handled by the Boom Operator. Other types of Booms in Grip include the C Boom and Menace Arm. The Engineering term that describes this sort of rig is the Cantilever. There are many kinds of Cantilevers in the world around us. A Menace Arm is a kind of Boom and also a kind of Cantilever. A Boom is a kind of Cantilever
but not the other way around. Other names for the Menace Arm include Pipe Boom (especially when using Speedrail? or Black Pipe), Dino (Los Angeles - Because it looks like a Dinosaur) and yes Cantilever. I prefer the term Cantilever because it doesn't sound Menacing, other grips know what I'm talking about when I use the word, other trades understand it, it's a bit more general and I just like how it sounds. This was probably too much info.

The Beaver Board is a 1K Pigeon Plate on a Pancake. The term is derogatory. Yes "Beaver" is slang for vagina. It doesn't describe a sexual position. It implies an alternate use as a crude sex toy. Use your imagination. The Barely Legal is a 2K Pigeon Plate on a Pancake. Again, use your imagination. The 2K to 1K Stand Adapter is also known as a Buttplug or 'Frisco Pin (West Coast) or Chelsea Pin (New York). Now you know. I don't use those terms on my jobs. Others do. We're all intelligent enough to make our own choices. I've chosen not to use crude terminology. The choice is yours. Choose wisely.

As a general rule diffusion is placed further away from a light source than color because that is where it is most effective. In the example of Grip frames once a light passes through a color frame, regeardless of distance between the fame and light source, the light becomes that color. However, with a diffusion frame the further the frame from the light source the more the frame is covered in light and the more the light is diffuse. The more diffuse the light the softer it is in quality. The same applies to gel used inside the barn doors and ouside the barn doors.

This is a general rule so unless specified we always put the diffusion gel further away from the source than color so that we can get the most out of that diffusion as possible. This isn't always what is wanted so it doesn't always have to be done that way.

I hope this was helpful. Don't be a pest and start analyzing everything. I'm not going to help you settle any bets either...

I like to work hard, have fun and be professional.

I learned that from working under my mentors. Check in with yours every now and then.

Later
Tshaka
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#11 Chris Pritzlaff

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Posted 05 August 2006 - 04:23 AM

I think that pretty much ends the challenge. All those responses sound right on to me. They only one I can definately confirm is that color goes before the diffusion as a general rule. Thanks for the detailed input Tshaka
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#12 Michael Nash

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Posted 05 August 2006 - 07:04 PM

Color goes before diffusion simply for practical reasons. The color of the light is usually pre-determined and will remain the same between setups once established, but the diffusion will get changed or tweaked between shots. And as noted, you need the diff to "live" a little father from the light just to get the desired softness and coverage out of it.

But as a matter of physics, color can go in front of diffusion if it has to. For example Helium balloons often have large pieces of gel on the outside for color correction, and I often put color on the face of a Chimera.
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#13 peter kantor

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Posted 06 August 2006 - 09:29 AM

thank you, thank you, thank you all, and here's the last one..

the fuzzy side of the duvetyne solid toward the lamp or away? It has to do with the the absorbancy of the fuzzy side and the remote chance that light can bounce off the tag (especially matthews tags which are white) and into an unwanted area. Does anyone know with certainty?

because I have heard conflicting information in the field is why I ask here. It seems more appropiate to ask nerdish (or pesty) questions here than on set because they're not safety related.

Rest asured there is no monetary displacment at stake here.

best regards
kantor
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#14 Tshaka

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Posted 06 August 2006 - 11:24 AM

thank you, thank you, thank you all, and here's the last one..

the fuzzy side of the duvetyne solid toward the lamp or away? It has to do with the the absorbancy of the fuzzy side and the remote chance that light can bounce off the tag (especially matthews tags which are white) and into an unwanted area. Does anyone know with certainty?

because I have heard conflicting information in the field is why I ask here. It seems more appropiate to ask nerdish (or pesty) questions here than on set because they're not safety related.

Rest asured there is no monetary displacment at stake here.

best regards
kantor


Kantor,

Don't be scared. Grip has been around long before the internet and The Grip Book. In those days Grips would learn on the job. We still do. If you can't ask the guys you work with then you're never going to learn from them. At what point are you ever going to feel like you're part of that crew?

Safety questions are not the only questions worth asking about Grip because there's much more to grip than safety.

There's no better place to ask a question than on set. It's just a question of when. When you're on set you can see the theories and techniques in practice. You might even be able to try things out under the supervision of a mentor or co-worker off set and out of the way because the gear is at your fingertips.

Then there's just your basic ability to observe and make judgements for yourself on what works and what doesn't and also what matters and what doesn't.

This forum is a great reference, The Grip Book is a wealth of information but Set experience is invaluable accept no substitutions.

There are stupid questions. Where you ask them doesn't make them any less stupid.

I'm not going to answer your question. Maybe someone else will. I think you can figure it out for yourself.

Ha! Ha! Now you've chosen to analyze everything and be a pest!

Later Kantor,
Tshaka
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#15 peter kantor

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Posted 06 August 2006 - 11:54 AM

uva's book does not show the tag ..perhaps he like you does not know?
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#16 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 06 August 2006 - 12:07 PM

Hi,

Also, if you put the diff on after the colour, it's less liable to cause reflections as the surface of a diffusion filter is usually nonspecular.

Phil
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#17 Jon Rosenbloom

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Posted 07 August 2006 - 05:45 PM

Phil's got it right re color and then diff. I believe the porn industry gave us the term "beaver board," as this was an arragement - a nail-on plate on a pancake - that was useful for placing a light on the floor that would illuminate a woman's genitals, aka "beaver."
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#18 peter kantor

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Posted 11 August 2006 - 12:47 PM

ok,

as far as the flag goes.. it does in fact get set with the "pretty side towards the scene"

thanks for all the responses
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