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Anyone used the XL1solutions PL lens adaptor?


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#1 Jason McKelvey

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Posted 05 August 2006 - 01:09 PM

Has anyone used the XL1solutions PL to Canon mount on there XLH1? It has no optics, so it only uses the middle 50% of a lens. So if you need an appearent 50mm focal length you have to use a 25mm PL lens or something to that effect.

http://www.xl1soluti...om/ADAPTERS.htm

$595 to purchase

I think they rent them too. Would someone please try this? We haven't got our XLH1 yet, but I'm itching to know if it works.

Jason
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#2 Robert Sanders

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 01:48 PM

Has anyone used the XL1solutions PL to Canon mount on there XLH1? It has no optics, so it only uses the middle 50% of a lens. So if you need an appearent 50mm focal length you have to use a 25mm PL lens or something to that effect.

http://www.xl1soluti...om/ADAPTERS.htm

$595 to purchase

I think they rent them too. Would someone please try this? We haven't got our XLH1 yet, but I'm itching to know if it works.

Jason


While it would interesting to see how high-end 35mm prime lenses would look on the H1 it certainly won't affect DOF very much. It's not the lens itself, but a myriad of things that create that shallow DOF we all crave. A lens targeting a 1/3" sensor will only be able to use the center of the lens. So you'll have to go to great lengths to figure out what your focal lengths will or will not be.
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#3 Daniel Stigler

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 01:58 PM

It's not the lens itself, but a myriad of things that create that shallow DOF we all crave.



It's the size of the area the lens is projecting the image on. The variables are the magnification and the iris setting. That's it.
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#4 Leo Anthony Vale

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 03:16 PM

While it would interesting to see how high-end 35mm prime lenses would look on the H1 it certainly won't affect DOF very much. It's not the lens itself, but a myriad of things that create that shallow DOF we all crave. A lens targeting a 1/3" sensor will only be able to use the center of the lens. So you'll have to go to great lengths to figure out what your focal lengths will or will not be.


---First, we don't all crave "that shallow DOF".

It's mostly the focal length of the lens that determines the DOF. There are other variables that effect the
DOF, but a not a myriad. & again, focal length is the most important.

One doesn't have to go to great lengths to figure out what the focal lengths will be.
They're engraved right on the lens!
If you're referring to the lens angle, that's still simple.

Since a 1/3" target is about the same as a regular 8mm frame, you'll get half the angle of tha same lens on 16mm.

So forget wide angles. This is for filming wildlife and adulterers in a divorce case.

---LV
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#5 Daniel Stigler

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 04:02 PM

It's mostly the focal length of the lens that determines the DOF. There are other variables that effect the
DOF, but a not a myriad. & again, focal length is the most important.



It's the magnification ratio. A short focal length in a close up will give you less DOF then a long focal length in a total shot with focus set to infinity.
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#6 John Benton

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 07:14 AM

I looked into this a few months back and reached similar conclusions. Huge magnification, however, you are working with the sweet spot on the lens.
I have the Letus35XL v.2 on my XlH1 and Love it. Quyen Le, who makes it, is working on a PL mount.
This may be a better solution
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#7 Leo Anthony Vale

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 01:23 PM

It's the magnification ratio. A short focal length in a close up will give you less DOF then a long focal length in a total shot with focus set to infinity.


---It's a COMBINATION of focal length, f/stop and subject distance. Not quite the myriad of things the other writer was obfuscating about.

I concentrated on focal length because of his silly pronouncement:
"So you'll have to go to great lengths to figure out what your focal lengths will or will not be."

But one choses the focal length to achieve the required image size and every else follows from that.

---LV
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#8 Mr. Shannon W. Rawls

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 11:19 PM

to answer your question Jason.......I havent met anyone who has used this adapter. i too would like to see some results or read a report on this mechanical unit. I emailed the company to work a barter, but didn't get a response.
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#9 Daniel Stigler

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 11:51 PM

But one choses the focal length to achieve the required image size and every else follows from that.




I fully agree with you Leo. Of course framing the same shot with a wideangle lens or with a tele lens has different side effects. For example the ever popular lens-straight-down-on-subject-camera-moves-straight-up-on-crane-shot looks a lot more dramatic on a wide angle lens.
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#10 Robert Sanders

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Posted 11 August 2006 - 05:19 PM

I keep forgetting how frickin' hostile it is in these forums. The argumentative nature in which people post responses on these boards is amazing.
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#11 Jason McKelvey

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Posted 15 August 2006 - 02:41 PM

This always sparks arguments... that's why I wanted to see if anyone has actually used it. The proof's in the pudding thing. Well, I hope get a H1 soon, so I'll rent one and let yall know what it looks like.

Jason
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#12 david west

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Posted 20 August 2006 - 04:27 AM

i actually made a similar adapter to use standard arri lenses.

it works, but a 50mm lens seemed like a 75-100 mm lens, and the focus ring numbers didnt work out the same.

oddly enouogh it did seem to have a little shallower DOF just because of the nature of the schneider lens compared to the stock canon lens..

http://www.sarena.bi...lclips/post.wmv

http://www.sarena.bi...ips/legsDOF.wmv

sorry about the shake, no follow focus...
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#13 shutter bug

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Posted 20 August 2006 - 07:30 AM

i actually made a similar adapter to use standard arri lenses.

it works, but a 50mm lens seemed like a 75-100 mm lens, and the focus ring numbers didnt work out the same.

oddly enouogh it did seem to have a little shallower DOF just because of the nature of the schneider lens compared to the stock canon lens..

http://www.sarena.bi...lclips/post.wmv

http://www.sarena.bi...ips/legsDOF.wmv

sorry about the shake, no follow focus...


is the schneider faster than the stock lens and are you using it wide open?
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#14 John Benton

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Posted 20 August 2006 - 12:26 PM

i actually made a similar adapter to use standard arri lenses.

it works, but a 50mm lens seemed like a 75-100 mm lens, and the focus ring numbers didnt work out the same.

oddly enouogh it did seem to have a little shallower DOF just because of the nature of the schneider lens compared to the stock canon lens..



David, thanks for posting these,
It's hard to compare the Quality of the Arri lens in these files (as opposed to say a 35mm adapter)
nevertheless very interesting
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#15 Jason McKelvey

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Posted 22 August 2006 - 05:40 PM

Their website claims that you retain the DOF characteristics that separate 35mm from 1/3" lenses... that was the big question. If putting a 50mm film lens on a XLH1 rendered the same DOF look of the standard Canon, what's the big deal. Yeah, the glass is better, but not worth the trouble. But if it helped it look more like film by providing that etherial DOF of 35mm lenses, that is a big deal. I can learn to do the math as far as picking lenses... if you want a focal length equal to a 50mm, use a 25mm. For $650 that's a good deal.

DAVID WEST: Have you used your adaptor for any real life shoots? Any clips that show fast rack focusing? Jason

Edited by Jason McKelvey, 22 August 2006 - 05:44 PM.

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#16 George White

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Posted 22 August 2006 - 10:36 PM

A couple of year?s ago I bought an XL1Solutions adapter to put my Nikon lenses on my XL1 naively thinking I would get 35mm-like DoF. It didn?t do that at all so I looked this stuff up.

From http://en.wikipedia..../Depth_of_field as well as many other sources, it is clear that DoF (for a given definition of ?in focus?) depends only on: 1. aperture; 2. image size at the point image is focused/captured; 3. focal length, and 4. distance to subject. (note ? details and quality of lens construction not on the list.)
But furthermore: check this and other sources to see that focal length and distance to subject essentially cancel each other out. If you think you will change to a smaller focal length to decrease the DoF -- wrong. You will then need to reduce the distance to the primary subject at the same time to keep the framing of that subject constant. The math works out that you will be right back where you were in DoF.

See the chart and other info in http://www.cambridge...th-of-field.htm. What that shows is for a given format (imaging size) and a given % filling of the frame by the primary subject, aperture is all that matters. When you read odd things like ?use ND filters to get smaller DoF? or ?we add light to increase the DoF? they are inelegantly saying (correctly) it?s the aperture that matters. There certainly is no magic in lens design or construction that does it. There is a reason the P+S and other adapters have the mechanisms they have and unfortunately a $600 thing doesn?t do what the $7000 thing does.

---george
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#17 Leo Anthony Vale

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Posted 23 August 2006 - 03:18 PM

Their website claims that you retain the DOF characteristics that separate 35mm from 1/3" lenses... that was the big question. If putting a 50mm film lens on a XLH1 rendered the same DOF look of the standard Canon, what's the big deal. Yeah, the glass is better, but not worth the trouble. But if it helped it look more like film by providing that etherial DOF of 35mm lenses, that is a big deal. I can learn to do the math as far as picking lenses... if you want a focal length equal to a 50mm, use a 25mm. For $650 that's a good deal.

DAVID WEST: Have you used your adaptor for any real life shoots? Any clips that show fast rack focusing? Jason


---But there is no innate difference in the DOF between 35mm lenses and 1/3"/8mm lenses. If their website claims there is, find another web site.

The only way that a 50mm film lens will give you shallower DOF the the Canon zoom set at 50mm is if the film lens is faster than the Canon zoom. A 50mm f/1.2 will do that. Better yet get Canon's EOS-AF adapter and the f/1.0 Canon.
The XL1 lets you use lenses faster and longer than the Canon zoom.

As to the math 1/3" video =8mm, not S8, film. So 50mm 35mmfilnm
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#18 Leo Anthony Vale

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Posted 23 August 2006 - 03:49 PM

The XL1 lets you use lenses faster and longer than the Canon zoom.

As to the math 1/3" video =8mm, not S8, film. So 50mm 35mmfilnm


---Sorry about that. My session expired.

The XL1 lets you use lenses faster and longer than the Canon zoom.
Which is how you get a shallower DOF than the Canon zoom.

As to the math: 1/3" video =8mm, not S8, film format. So a 10/11mm 1/3" lens gives the angle of a 50mm 35mmcine format lens. And a 50mm on 1/3" is equivilent to a 250mm 35cineformat. Bending over backwards to get a shallow DOF.

Study G.Whites link, not the claims of salesmen.
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#19 Jason McKelvey

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Posted 25 August 2006 - 10:41 PM

Very interesting, thanks Leo and George. Jason

Edited by Jason McKelvey, 25 August 2006 - 10:43 PM.

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