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Telecine Techniques


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#1 Ramon OROZCO

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Posted 14 August 2006 - 02:36 PM

Hi guys!

My question is the following, (maybe a silly one), but I was wondering if there is a particular technique, procedure or way of doing a proper telecine work for commercials and/or videos. I.e. like first work on the contrast and then alter the colors or vice versa
Or first work on the primary colors and then move to the secondary ones. Etc.
I mean the do?s and don?ts for the telecine
I would also know if any of you have like some helpful tips or some ?secret formula? to archive nice telecine corrections.

Warm ones.
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#2 Jon-Hebert Barto

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Posted 15 August 2006 - 05:17 PM

Hey Ramon,

Firstly, nice to have you aboard. It's always nice to see new people, I'm very new myself....

Secondly, if you are not a "working" DOP, meaning a professional, you should probably change your profession title to student or something else. It's good to have a clear line between those who do it for a living and everyone else...has to do with respect. :)

Lastly, there are untold amounts of books on the subject. We, that is the admin. Tim not "myself", have put a thread on the site with rec'd books concerning every aspect of filming. Color correction, everything! Its at the bottom of the first forum page. It would take days of posting by the members here to answer not only this question you have, but all the others that would undoubtably follow.

Spend time researching on the forum...you'll find alot of your Q's answered with no need to post. This site is set up perfectly for new users, take advantage. :)

-Jonnie
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#3 Sam Wells

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Posted 15 August 2006 - 06:11 PM

Well I like to see what I call the "ideal state" of what's on the negative before going 'creative'

I would encourage colorist to first roll forward into enough of the footage to get an overall sense of where you're coming from rather than getting painstaking on shot one... it's a getting aquainted thing and it's getting the colorist to see how you're seeing...

I actually watch the rolls going by in fast rewind like a hawk when they roll to the head to start, don't blink now :D

-Sam
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#4 Jonathan Benny

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Posted 15 August 2006 - 07:39 PM

but I was wondering if there is a particular technique, procedure or way of doing a proper telecine work for commercials and/or videos. I.e. like first work on the contrast and then alter the colors or vice versa
Or first work on the primary colors and then move to the secondary ones. Etc.
I mean the do?s and don?ts for the telecine


A properly balanced color chart will put in the right direction any footage that comes after it (if the look is built into the negative and assuming you're not doing heavy color/contrast fx work on the image).

Once this is done, we can look at the footage and see how much we need to nudge it either way to achieve that look we are going for. Its important to be very clear about what mood you are trying to achieve and in what context - I've always found this to be far better than getting into issues related to how to achieve the effects technically. A good colorist knows the gear and will be creative in how to get the look you are going for.

Nothing beats a good discussion with the colorist/grader before the work starts.

AJB
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#5 Sam Wells

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Posted 16 August 2006 - 09:57 AM

A properly balanced color chart will put in the right direction any footage that comes after it (if the look is built into the negative and assuming you're not doing heavy color/contrast fx work on the image).


True enough but as soon as it comes up right I think ok now let's see where we really need to go :D

Unless it's scanning for a DI I think telecine is inherently an act of translation; sometimes it can be (or approach), and sometimes can't be "literal"

-Sam Wells
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#6 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 16 August 2006 - 11:51 AM

If it's a narrative piece in particular, one thing I like to do is scroll to the most representative shot of the scene and color-correct that first (usually it's the wider shot), and then store a frame as a reference, then go back to the start of the scene and begin working. Same with certain faces -- if the colorist doesn't do it automatically, ask him to frame store certain shots that you will be matching other shots to.

The other thing is to constantly readjust your eyes by asking to see the uncorrected shot after you correct the shot, now & then. Otherwise, if you are going for a certain strong look, like lots of saturation or a heavy blue night look, you don't want your eyes to adjust and see it as "normal" because then you'll start overdoing the effect. So it helps to look at a neutral or uncorrected shot.

I also glance over at the waveforms now & then to make sure that the blacks are black.
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#7 Michael Rizzi

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Posted 16 August 2006 - 02:16 PM

Nothing beats a good discussion with the colorist/grader before the work starts.


Hi,

I couldn't agree more. I feel your colorist can be a very important piece of the collaborative puzzle. Often they are seeing the footage for the first time, (in commercials and music videos) unlike someone who times dailies for a TV show or feature, so they might not have any idea what look you want to achieve. Talking to them a bit about the production and the idea and giving them visual references is something I like to do. Anything from a still from a movie to a magazine ad. After a short discussion I like to have them show me their interpretation of what we talked about and see what they can come up with based on the footage in front of them and the look they think I want. Often times they come up with something great that I never would have thought about doing. After that, I'll then give my suggestions and we'll go on from there.

I agree with David when he says to first time a representative or wide shot. That definitely helps set the tone.

Hope this helps.

Rizzi
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#8 Jonathan Benny

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Posted 16 August 2006 - 11:57 PM

True enough but as soon as it comes up right I think ok now let's see where we really need to go :


Nice. Well, in the case of going off an IP on a feature we can spend lots of time on the first roll if a good percentage of the look will be established there and then it is a matter of matching most of the following 5 or 6 rolls. I've just finished timing a feature that is going to a bleach bypass print. We will be matching the look from an non-bbp IP to HD. The colorist will watch the print and then we will "see where we really need to go" on the transfer as we will have all the digital possabilities at our disposal.

AJB
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Paralinx LLC

Tai Audio

CineTape

Aerial Filmworks

Opal

Visual Products

FJS International, LLC

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

rebotnix Technologies

Wooden Camera

The Slider

Willys Widgets

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

CineLab

Technodolly

Ritter Battery

Metropolis Post

Glidecam

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Rig Wheels Passport