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Ektachrome 100D: The New King of Super 8


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#1 Anthony Schilling

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 01:28 AM

I got my first roll of DS8 100D back today and can't stop watching it, this is the best looking stuff I have ever projected. Rich, colorful, and full of detail... It literally blows K40 and 64T away. It looked just as good as the 16mm 100D I have projected.

VS K40: it has a lot more latatude, way better colors... especially the greens, yellows, much cleaner whites, and rich blacks. The extra speed lets you see a lot more in a scene. The 100D is also a lot sharper with a lot more detail. The grain holds up better as well. It looks modern, but still has the S8 aesthetic for sure. K40 does not hold a candle to this stuff.

VS 64T: Far less grain, I can't even see grain on the projection. 64T, with it's lower speed and course grain has a narrow window to look good, 100D handles much better.

It is a pure crime that this stuff in not available in S8 carts! I will continue using it in DS8, but would like to get crazy with single frame and timelapses in S8 on this stuff! for God's sake, somebody do something!!!!!!!
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#2 Mark Dunn

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 03:08 AM

I think Wittner are putting 100D is cartridges, at a price.
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#3 Ian Marks

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 08:50 AM

Anthony, where are you purchasing your Double Super 8 Ektachrome?
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#4 Mark Dunn

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 09:56 AM

Wittner sell that, too. http://www.wittner-k...mm/d8_filmm.php


Oops, my mistake, that's just double-8.
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#5 Anthony Schilling

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 10:12 AM

I think Wittner are putting 100D is cartridges, at a price.

Yes, I have used a few carts from them. But it's a real debocle to order it from them and get it here in the US. And once I shot it, the results were sligtly fogged... maybe from being x-rayed too much in it's travel? I dunno. I've also used pro8 100D and had bad results. But this batch of double super 8 was from John Schwind here in the US, and was fresh. Finally got the density and saturation that I was used to in 16mm. And finally proved to myself what this stock could look like in S8, if only I could get some fresh stuff. It's truley amazing.
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#6 Andrew Means

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 10:35 AM

Yes, I have used a few carts from them. But it's a real debocle to order it from them and get it here in the US. And once I shot it, the results were sligtly fogged... maybe from being x-rayed too much in it's travel? I dunno. I've also used pro8 100D and had bad results. But this batch of double super 8 was from John Schwind here in the US, and was fresh. Finally got the density and saturation that I was used to in 16mm. And finally proved to myself what this stock could look like in S8, if only I could get some fresh stuff. It's truley amazing.


Dang, pro8mm's 100D was bad? Anybody else have issue with it? I was inches away from buying some...
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#7 Douglas Hunter

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 12:15 PM

Dang, pro8mm's 100D was bad? Anybody else have issue with it? I was inches away from buying some...



I shot two loads of 100d from pro8mm in August, both were fine and I have a few more in the fridge that I hope to shoot in the next few weeks, I'll let you know if there are any problems.

I think the 100D is a pretty great stock, and I think it will cut well with the velvia 50 D, my current favorite.
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#8 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 01:18 PM

I got my first roll of DS8 100D back today and can't stop watching it, this is the best looking stuff I have ever projected. Rich, colorful, and full of detail... It literally blows K40 and 64T away. It looked just as good as the 16mm 100D I have projected.

VS K40: it has a lot more latitude, way better colors... especially the greens, yellows, much cleaner whites, and rich blacks. The extra speed lets you see a lot more in a scene. The 100D is also a lot sharper with a lot more detail. The grain holds up better as well. It looks modern, but still has the S8 aesthetic for sure. K40 does not hold a candle to this stuff.

VS 64T: Far less grain, I can't even see grain on the projection. 64T, with it's lower speed and course grain has a narrow window to look good, 100D handles much better.

It is a pure crime that this stuff in not available in S8 carts! I will continue using it in DS8, but would like to get crazy with single frame and timelapses in S8 on this stuff! for God's sake, somebody do something!!!!!!!


The older Kodachrome was amazing stuff, up until the early 90's, after that, I don't know.

As for Ektachrome 100D, it won't properly expose in many automatic super-8 cameras specifically because it is 100 ASA. On top of that, have you shot the 100D in the bright mid day sun with an automatic camera? Even if the camera recognizes it as 100D, the proper exposure could easily reach f-16 or higher and shooting with most cameras at such a high f-stop number usually is not a good thing. If the camera does not recognize 100ASA and instead "sees" it as 40ASA, then it overexpose the film, if it reads the 100D as 160, it will not only underexpose the film but it will most definitely exceed f-16 in bright environments, some cameras could conceiveably iris down all the way.

I wouldn't be against a "list" of the cameras that could shoot the film stock properly but than that would reduce the "business case" for releasing the stock.
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#9 Douglas Hunter

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 01:35 PM

As for Ektachrome 100D, it won't properly expose in many automatic super-8 cameras specifically because it is 100 ASA.

I wouldn't be against a "list" of the cameras that could shoot the film stock properly but than that would reduce the "business case" for releasing the stock.



But today more than ever, to shoot super 8 is just like shooting 16 or 35, you need to, and really should want to, take control of exposure. I don't understand why anyone would want to shoot film, but not control exposure, that just makes no sense. Controlling exposure is an inherent part of using film. At least in my mind. So I don't think the fact that some cameras can't read it in auto mode makes any difference at all.

As for the other part of your post, there are these things called ND filters . . .
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#10 Anthony Schilling

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 02:59 PM

This recent batch was DS8 shot with the Canon Scoopic... so I was able to dial in the ASA at 100. Fortunately the meter is dead on. I was out shooting some more today (bright sunny) and was reading between 16-22, but I just made use of the variable shutter and cut 2 stops with a 45 degree shutter... plus I really like the effect of a fast shutter. Otherwise there are always ND filters... I have plusX in my Nizo today, but have an ND .9 to bring me down to f5.6/8. Not to mention ND filters are a lot easier to find in different sizes than 85B filters.

The Wittner carts are notched just like plusX and should read properly in almost any S8 cam... The Pro8 carts, I was told were notched for 40ASA but appear to be the same as 64ASA so some compensation is required there.
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#11 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 11 October 2006 - 05:00 PM

But today more than ever, to shoot super 8 is just like shooting 16 or 35, you need to, and really should want to, take control of exposure. I don't understand why anyone would want to shoot film, but not control exposure, that just makes no sense. Controlling exposure is an inherent part of using film. At least in my mind. So I don't think the fact that some cameras can't read it in auto mode makes any difference at all.

As for the other part of your post, there are these things called ND filters . . .


I'm just explaining that if Kodak releases a super-8 film stock and not all Super-8 cameras will correctly recognize the 100 ASA value, it reduces the amount of users for the product that can properly use the film. It appears that 64T is about as far away from 40T that Kodak wants to venture when it comes to ASA for a reversal stock.

Although Plus-X used to be 40 ASA and now is 100 ASA and apparently that niche format has survived in Super-8.
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#12 Gary Lemson

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Posted 12 October 2006 - 09:54 AM

I got my first roll of DS8 100D back today and can't stop watching it, this is the best looking stuff I have ever projected.


Are you going to post the footage for us to see?
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#13 Anthony Schilling

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Posted 13 October 2006 - 02:43 AM

Are you going to post the footage for us to see?

I don't have a host to post online, but it wouldn't do it justice compressed online anyway. But I gurentee anyone that projects or transfers some fresh 100D will be very pleased.
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#14 Andrew Means

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Posted 13 October 2006 - 03:20 AM

I don't have a host to post online...


Youtube?
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#15 Anthony Schilling

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Posted 13 October 2006 - 03:30 AM

Youtube makes everthing look like a cell phone recording, but what the hell... I'm going to recapture it first, just captured a little bit in the daytime, some heavy reflective artifact. But I'll see about getting some up soon.

Edited by Anthony Schilling, 13 October 2006 - 03:32 AM.

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#16 Mark Dunn

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Posted 13 October 2006 - 03:48 AM

help us out here, OP- the Scoopic is 16mm..
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#17 Sean McHenry

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Posted 13 October 2006 - 06:07 AM

Google has been doing pretty good with their Flash codec lately. Take a look at my goofy digital short "Cat Fight at OK and Corral" to see a decent conversion. For Google, it all starts with a good clean encode in a format they can easily convert.

http://www.DeepBlueE...m/Portfolio.htm

I think it looks fairly good but it's B&W from a 24p Canon XL-H1 in MiniDV mode encoded originally as a high level WMV file to send to Google for conversion to Flash 8. As I recall, by the time it had finished uploading, it was ready to watch. Very fast for that particular upload. I just watched it on a Dell Laptop here at work and I admit, it looks pretty bad on this laptop so your settings may vary. It really looks good on my home PC and my personal HP laptop.

Maybe some good stills posted someplace?

Sean

Edited by Sean McHenry, 13 October 2006 - 06:09 AM.

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#18 David W Scott

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Posted 13 October 2006 - 09:47 AM

help us out here, OP- the Scoopic is 16mm..


...and Double Super 8.

Scoopic info

You might also be interested to know that Ikonoskop are interested in making a Double Super 8 version of the A-Cam if there were enough interest.

A-Cam page
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#19 Matthew Buick

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Posted 13 October 2006 - 08:00 PM

Can someone post a really Hi-Res screenshot of some E100D.
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#20 Richard Tuohy

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 03:45 AM

Yes, I have used a few carts from them. But it's a real debocle to order it from them and get it here in the US. And once I shot it, the results were sligtly fogged... maybe from being x-rayed too much in it's travel? I dunno. I've also used pro8 100D and had bad results. But this batch of double super 8 was from John Schwind here in the US, and was fresh. Finally got the density and saturation that I was used to in 16mm. And finally proved to myself what this stock could look like in S8, if only I could get some fresh stuff. It's truley amazing.


I have in front of me a cart of Wittner 100d, a acrt of Pro8mm 100d, a cart of Plus-x 7265 and a cart of 64t.
100d should be notched with a 0.5 inch distance from the centre pin to the bottom of the speed notch. The Plus-x 7265 has this 0.5 inch notch distance and no filter notch (the notching for 100d). The Wittner 100d has a 0.6inch notch and no filter notch (the notching for 80d), the pro8mm has a 0.7 inch notch distance and no filter notch (notching for 40d). 64t has the same 0.7 inch notch but has a filter notch (correct for 64t).
I sell the Pro8mm 100d. Its a very nice stock - I think the best super 8 reversal film ever put in a cart. But I always re-notch the 100d carts before I send them so they are notched with the correct 0.5 inch notch for 100d.
If you shot pro8mm in a notch reading camera it would over expose 1 and 1/3rd stops. Was this the problem you had?
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