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KONVAS M2 steadyness problems


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#1 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 09:20 AM

Hi,
I recently shot with a KONVAS M2 and had bproblems with the frame steadyness, not only in vertical but sometimes also in horizontal position. (we used always the same mag, so it could be also a mag roblem)As we shot nearly everything from the tripod in locked position, this is quiet bad.
Does anybody know if there is someone in europe who can do servicing on this camera ( I'm from Italy).
I could send the camera also to KIEV for service, as I have friends there.
We also had a flangefocus problem with one of the lenses.
Is it possible that if you focus closer than the nearest indication on the lensbarrel, this causes out of focus images?

thanks
daniel
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#2 Richard Boddington

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 09:37 AM

Hi,
I recently shot with a KONVAS M2 and had bproblems with the frame steadyness, not only in vertical but sometimes also in horizontal position. (we used always the same mag, so it could be also a mag roblem)As we shot nearly everything from the tripod in locked position, this is quiet bad.
Does anybody know if there is someone in europe who can do servicing on this camera ( I'm from Italy).
I could send the camera also to KIEV for service, as I have friends there.
We also had a flangefocus problem with one of the lenses.
Is it possible that if you focus closer than the nearest indication on the lensbarrel, this causes out of focus images?

thanks
daniel



Poor registration is common with some Konvas cameras 1M or 2M. Servicing may help, then again you may spend some cash and get little in return. My advice would be to buy a new 2M off ebay since they're so cheap and try your luck again. I found that I never got good registration with the 400 foot mags and 400ft loads no matter what I did. 200ft in a 400ft mag was passable. The best Konvas registration I got was with a new 1M and 150ft loads, it was 99% near perfect.

As for the focus issues well from the sounds of what you're describing you would have focus issues with any lens that you focus closer than it's minimum distance. If the minimum focus on a lens is three feet, and you have the camera two feet from the subject, you'll have a problem. You would need a close up lens in this case that you can screw onto the lens. Sets are available at any photo shop.

Wide lenses will focus much closer than long lenses without any addidtional lens on it.

R,
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#3 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 09:46 AM

[
As for the focus issues well from the sounds of what you're describing you would have focus issues with any lens that you focus closer than it's minimum distance. If the minimum focus on a lens is three feet, and you have the camera two feet from the subject, you'll have a problem. You would need a close up lens in this case that you can screw onto the lens. Sets are available at any photo shop.

Wide lenses will focus much closer than long lenses without any addidtional lens on it.

R,
[/quote]



With fokusing closer than minimum distance I intended, that I could turn the focus wheel more than to the distance written on the barrel, and saw in the viewefinder (at full open iris) a sharp picture.
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#4 Steve Larsen

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 11:12 AM

Hi,
I recently shot with a KONVAS M2 and had bproblems with the frame steadyness, not only in vertical but sometimes also in horizontal position. (we used always the same mag, so it could be also a mag roblem)As we shot nearly everything from the tripod in locked position, this is quiet bad.


Hi Daniel, If you loop size is not correct in the mags you will also have registration problems. I have seen a few instructions online on how to thread the mag, the best from commiecam.com but after many, many scratch tests and then a registration test I have found a loop size that works for me. There are photo's on the www.konvas.info website in the "how to" album of my loop sizes. I shot my reg test with the loops like this a small mag and a 100' load and the guy at the lab was surprised when I told him the camera did not have a registration pin.

Steve.

http://www.konvas.info/v/admin/loop/
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#5 Richard Boddington

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 11:13 AM

"With fokusing closer than minimum distance I intended, that I could turn the focus wheel more than to the distance written on the barrel, and saw in the viewefinder (at full open iris) a sharp picture."

Yes but that means very little. That's why in film you always see people measuring the shot and checking DOF charts, and going by the marks on the lens.

In video you can focus by eye because what you see on your monitor is the final, but you can't do that with film.

R,
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#6 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 11:42 AM

Thanks, the loopsize might matter, as I believe that I made the loop towards the takeupside bigger than pictured.
As to the focusing, we did measure and use the dof charts of the american cinematographer manual, but as we were notnot 100% sure if all the lenses were ok with the flangefocus distance, we doublechecked also with the vievefinder, (metering result and viewefinder check did always match) especially when shooting in the "macro" region where no marks were on the lensbarrel.
I once had to do so already with an ARRI 3, and results were perfect.
In fact not always the "macro" shots were out of focus, sometimes the fokus seems to get out of fokus during the shot, I thought that maybe the pressure of the pressureplate in the magazine was to weak.
(we continued work on my AATON ltr7 and Bolex SBM (both super16) and now results are ok but of course not 35mm anymore)

thanks again

daniel
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#7 Stephen Williams

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 12:27 PM

Hi,

The FFD could easily be wrong or the ground glass not accurately collimated. An autocollimator will let you see what is happening when the film is running.

Usually macro focussing by eye is easy because depth of field and depth of focus are inversely proportional.

If the mag is not seated propley then you will have an issue with focus and steadyness.

Stephen
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#8 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 12:35 PM

Thanks,
actually the mag should have ben seated propperly, because I had noticed, that sometimes it seems to to be put on right, but then you see, that it is not, and the camera would run anyhow. So I double and tripplechecked this always, first by moving the motor manually, while putting on the mag, in order that the transportdents would properly fit ito the dented wheel on the mag, and then by checking, if the lockinglever really went all the way back minto the locked position. Still this is an issue that makes me feel a little uneasy when working with the konvas, as I dont know how I really can know if the mag is put on perfectly.

daniel
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#9 Christian Appelt

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Posted 22 October 2006 - 05:32 PM

Daniel,

the most likely causes for your registration problem:

1. Mag trouble - has the mag been opened, cleaned, lubricated? Get another mag on eBay or from some trustworthy dealer (like www.rafcamera.com), two or three mags should be with every Konvas.
Just some hints on mag problems: In the mag, there is a small pressure pad and a spring-loaded side rail to guide the film in the gate. I have seen many Konvas mags with maladjusted springs - registration will suffer when the film is not guided properly.
With Konvas and Caméflex cameras, the mag is not just a film chamber that snaps on the camera body - the mag is part of the film gate.

6 or 7 out of 10 Konvas mags which I bought were in need of cleaning, lubrication and thorough checking of every screw and bolt. DO NOT EXPECT USED KONVAS EQUIPMENT TO RUN WITHOUT SERVICE.


2. Has the camera been cleaned and lubricated? If the mechanism has not been lubricated properly, it will run very loud and with unnecessary friction. This can cause bad registration. If you remove the motor, can you turn the gear wheel with the tip of your finger (without hurting yourself) ? If not, the gears need service.

A Konvas that runs with "unhealthy" grinding noise will suffer from vibration, vibration may cause bad registration.
A well-serviced Konvas can produce excellent steadiness - IMHO the best of any non-pin-registered 35mm camera (except Aäton, of course).
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#10 dancordle

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Posted 05 December 2006 - 01:28 PM

[quote name='daniel mahlknecht' date='Oct 14 2006, 10:20 AM' post='132767']
Hi,
I recently shot with a KONVAS M2 and had bproblems with the frame steadyness, not only in vertical but sometimes also in horizontal position.

Hi Daniel,

When servicing your mag, make sure you check the inside the rails where the film travels. Dirt in the rails can lead to horizontal weaving.

Best,
Dan Cordle
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#11 Thomas Worth

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Posted 06 December 2006 - 12:16 AM

In video you can focus by eye because what you see on your monitor is the final, but you can't do that with film.

This is a blanket statement I don't necessarily agree with. Yes, it is true that the CCD in a video camera invariably sends the same image to both the tape and the viewfinder, and yes, you should never assume that a film camera's film plane and ground glass are matched. But in the case of the Konvas, it is very easy to check and see if the film and the prism are receiving the same image, and adjust to fix any discrepancies. I focus through the viewfinder on my Konvas all the time and get perfect results.

But if they aren't matched, forget it. :(
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#12 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 28 February 2007 - 08:12 AM

Hi,
in the meantime the registration problems with the convas M2 have been resolved. The camera has been serviced at Studio Hamburg, and they found, that the pressure of the pressureplates in the mags was to weak. Now everything is working.

Daniel
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#13 Christian Appelt

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Posted 28 February 2007 - 02:32 PM

Daniel, good to hear the problem has been solved. It's easy to check the correct pressure of the plaste now and then - and remember, if you get extra mags, check if they have the right spring power. It's a quite simple mechanism, just have to know what to look out for... ;) Happy shooting!
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