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what is telecine, and...


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#1 william everett

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Posted 19 December 2006 - 01:28 PM

why do I need it?

(I shoot a 35mm film, splice the scenes together, have the negative printed, then print a positive, and I'm done, yes?)

Edited by williameverett, 19 December 2006 - 01:29 PM.

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#2 Nick Mulder

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Posted 19 December 2006 - 01:45 PM

why do I need it?

(I shoot a 35mm film, splice the scenes together, have the negative printed, then print a positive, and I'm done, yes?)


You certainly dont need it no, its just the way its done now with so many films, adverts etc.. being digitally adhered to nowadays

If you have those skills and can shoot any effects you might want in-camera (Titling etc...) I say go for it.

You'll need A and B rolls for fades to black and image to image crossfades you'll need a workprint also, so your not scratching up your neg. And a very clean room when it comes to conforming the negs ...

I've never done it but have a 16mm moviola synconiser, splicers and film chalky goo stuff here (for writing all those symbols) - just need a viewer... would love to try it on a small film one day
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#3 Laurent Andrieux

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Posted 19 December 2006 - 05:30 PM

It's a question of editing. If you can edit the traditional way, have no special effects at all, got that way. If you want to edit on a computer, you need a TK, that's all.
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#4 Oscar Godfrey

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Posted 19 December 2006 - 06:59 PM

Also if you have you're film telecined and edit it that way, you will then need to have it printed back to film again if you want to project it.
I can't believe that this process would not lose a great deal of the original quality of the film. I know a lot of modern films do this, so it must be alright, but it is the major issue that concerns me about editing on a computer.
You could edit on a computer using you're telecined film, then using that as a reference, cut the original negatives by hand.
It's also much easier to sync up sound using a computer.

Actually, i have a question about that. If a film is to be printed from a digital file, what sort of format is it sent to the lab in, and how do they deal with the sound?
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#5 Will Earl

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Posted 19 December 2006 - 07:27 PM

Also if you have you're film telecined and edit it that way, you will then need to have it printed back to film again if you want to project it.
I can't believe that this process would not lose a great deal of the original quality of the film. I know a lot of modern films do this, so it must be alright, but it is the major issue that concerns me about editing on a computer.
You could edit on a computer using you're telecined film, then using that as a reference, cut the original negatives by hand.
It's also much easier to sync up sound using a computer.

Actually, i have a question about that. If a film is to be printed from a digital file, what sort of format is it sent to the lab in, and how do they deal with the sound?


No one does a filmout from an offline edit, which is done in SD resolutions and highly compressed - it's only been within the last few years that films have started to edit in HD and even so it's very much the exception and not the rule.

You edit in the computer and then make an EDL (Edit Decision List). The original negative is then cut and spliced together to match the EDL.

Hopefully this article explains the negative conforming process better...

http://www.digitalin...le.jsp?id=29092

If you do wish to do a filmout from a digital source then you should be handing the lab a 2K Cineon/DPX image sequence. I'm not sure on the technical details of how they get the digital audio onto the film print, but they do it somehow.
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#6 Oscar Godfrey

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Posted 19 December 2006 - 07:56 PM

What about all the shots with digital effects in? Digital effects must have been around for about 15 years now. These must be printed to film somehow?
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#7 Michael Collier

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Posted 19 December 2006 - 09:21 PM

Typically a telecine is needed if you want to do a digital offline, which is recomended, especially for students. Once you have the final EDL, a negative conform proccess starts, usually with a professional neg cutter, but if you take your time you can do it yourself. Once the neg is conformed (either into single strand or A/B rolls) the film goes through the IP/IN proccess so your ready to strike a print.

If your planning on printing back onto film, then the telecine is not enough (not the typical SD one-light or best light you may get for your offline) so a 2K scan (or 4K or similar) gets scanned and color corrected and then printed onto film, with something like the arri laser. The house doing the DI, as its called, usually handles the scanning, color correction and film-out, since every house I have talked to has a slightly different proccess. They may scan your neg either from an assembly made by a negative cutter, or using your EDL just capture the portions used and conform that in the computer.

Digital effects are done much the same way, for either DI or photo-chem proccess. The digial plate is used to create proofs, digital low-res, incomplete effects that the editor can use as a rough guide for their offline. Once the effect has been finalized, that effects shot (which final output would be similar to a 2K scan in resolution and information) and is either added to the DI project, or put onto film with a laser recorder and then cut into the assembly like any other peice of footage.

Film lasers are quite expensive (around 500/minute range) and the whole DI proccess can get quite expensive. By contrast, it may cost only 2000-5000 to have a negative cutter conform your negative to the EDL.

A telecine is needed since few films post on a flatbed anymore (not that none do, but few, and no major films) The reason is with a flatbed, your out of pocket to create one work print. If you mess up or loose a bit of the print for any reason, then you must re-print that section. Its time consuming costly, and in the end, digital is much, much easier to make a change, view it immediatley, recut and try new things. A telecine runs in the $.15/ft range for 16mm, while printing a workprint costs much more. Edit at home on a laptop and you might save money. Since the telecine itself doesn't get projected, rather a print made from the original negative that has been cut according to the EDL generated from the telecined material, no information is lost.
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#8 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 19 December 2006 - 09:53 PM

Why do you need a telecine? Because most people over the years to follow will see your film in some video format or another, not a projected print. These days, it would be easier to live without a film print than it would without a video master...
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#9 Patrick Cooper

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Posted 20 December 2006 - 08:18 AM

To answer your initial question - 'what is telecine? - telecine is the process of transferring movie film to video. Most film productions that shoot on film specifically for video transfer will use negative film which gives the desired amount of contrast when played back on video (there is always an increase in contrast with telecine) and negative film is lower contrast to begin with. Most reversal films are designed so that they give the appropriate amount of contrast when projected. However, when telecining reversal films, the transferred footage can sometimes appear just a little bit too 'contrasty.'
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