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diffusion filter on mini dv??


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#1 Daniel Carruthers

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Posted 29 December 2006 - 03:51 PM

hey, I was wondering if anyone has ever used diffusion filters on the dvx100a.
I like the look of diffusion, but ive only ever seen it on 35mm film.
would diffusion on minidv lose image quality??
I was interested in purchasing the Black Promist filter from tiffen, I want a strong effect from it so i was thinking of getting a 3black pro mist.
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#2 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 29 December 2006 - 04:04 PM

A No.3 Black Promist would put your shot firmly into the 'Dream Sequence/Flashback/Wedding Video' category. It depends what you want from the effect. A lot of people use the lighter BPM's (1/8, 1/4, 1/2) with video, to take the edge off the video 'look'. It's a matter of taste. For me, anything stronger than a 1/2 promist is too strong, unless I want an FX look.
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#3 Daniel Carruthers

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Posted 29 December 2006 - 04:29 PM

I sure dont want a wedding video look!
I just like what the promist does to highlights, like in Casino, or Bringing out the Dead.
Do you know what Robert Richardson used in those movies?
But I think I will stick to 1/2 promist instead of a 3.
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#4 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 29 December 2006 - 04:45 PM

I just like what the promist does to highlights, like in Casino, or Bringing out the Dead.
Do you know what Robert Richardson used in those movies?
But I think I will stick to 1/2 promist instead of a 3.


A #1/4 (White) ProMist should give you that look. Or a #1/2 Black ProMist. As long as it is combined with some bright areas in the frame to halate (glow.)

Richardson used a net for most of "Bringing Out the Dead" instead of a ProMist like his earlier films. If you want more of a net effect without a net, less foggy/glowy than a ProMist, I'd try something like a #1 Tiffen Soft-FX.
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#5 Jim Feldspar

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Posted 29 December 2006 - 08:46 PM

A #1/4 (White) ProMist should give you that look. Or a #1/2 Black ProMist. As long as it is combined with some bright areas in the frame to halate (glow.)

Richardson used a net for most of "Bringing Out the Dead" instead of a ProMist like his earlier films. If you want more of a net effect without a net, less foggy/glowy than a ProMist, I'd try something like a #1 Tiffen Soft-FX.

I've used a net to take away the video look before by cutting some black
stockings and stretching a piece across the lens hood and fastening with an elastic.

On a big budget movie, what does somebody like Richardson use for a net and how is
it attached and where? I was only about an inch in front of the lens but with matte boxes
would it be different?

#1/4 (White) ProMist and a #1/2 Black ProMist sound very different to me. White/Black,
different sizes. Why would they give a similar look or do you mean that they'll both cause
halation but otherwise have different looks (and if so what would they be?) that would
depend on one's taste?

What does "more of a net effect" mean? I'm guessing that you're discussing nets vs. filters.
Do you mean softer, less video sharpness because that's mostly what I got (and also some
slash filter effect on street lights, kind of like when you look at a streetlight through a screen)
but not much glow with the net.


I'd be very grateful if you could answer. Thanks.
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#6 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 29 December 2006 - 09:28 PM

Nets are either stretched onto filter frame and put in the mattebox -- or stretched over the back of the lens. I assume Richardson is using them over the back of the lens but I don't know for sure.

A 1/2 Black ProMist and a 1/2 White ProMist are the same filter in terms of the heaviness of the mist particles, only the Black version has black specks added to reduce the loss of contrast, otherwise, it's the same filter as the White version.

This is why it tends to look lighter in strength than the White version, hence why I equate a 1/4 White Promist to a 1/2 Black ProMist, even though in theory it should be the same number for the same strength of effect.

Basically a Black ProMist look is just a little less foggy/milky than a White ProMist look.

In DV, you have to be careful not to stop down the lens too much or else the particles come into soft focus, making it look like you have a dusty lens or something.
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#7 Jim Feldspar

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Posted 29 December 2006 - 11:34 PM

Nets are either stretched onto filter frame and put in the mattebox -- or stretched over the back of the lens. I assume Richardson is using them over the back of the lens but I don't know for sure.

A 1/2 Black ProMist and a 1/2 White ProMist are the same filter in terms of the heaviness of the mist particles, only the Black version has black specks added to reduce the loss of contrast, otherwise, it's the same filter as the White version.

This is why it tends to look lighter in strength than the White version, hence why I equate a 1/4 White Promist to a 1/2 Black ProMist, even though in theory it should be the same number for the same strength of effect.

Basically a Black ProMist look is just a little less foggy/milky than a White ProMist look.

In DV, you have to be careful not to stop down the lens too much or else the particles come into soft focus, making it look like you have a dusty lens or something.


Got it! Thanks a lot!
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#8 Chris Durham

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Posted 04 January 2007 - 04:34 PM

In DV, you have to be careful not to stop down the lens too much or else the particles come into soft focus, making it look like you have a dusty lens or something.


A couple weeks back I was viewing some DV footage and was asked how all that dust got on the lens and only in this shot (it was one of several performances at a renaissance festival). I had no clue. After reading this post I realized that it was one of the first things I shot with my SoftFX 3 soft diffusion filter. I had to set up really quick to get it and probably stopped it down in a hurry instead of adjusting shutter speed or messing with my ND filters. That clears that up a lot - especially for future shots. Thanks.
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#9 Chad Stockfleth

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Posted 04 January 2007 - 05:17 PM

Well, David and Stuart pretty well summed this one up, but allow me to present another option.

You can achieve a similar effect, though not exact by doing the stacked slide trick.

It goes like this: Take your video, and make a copy of it as a layer underneath. Add a blur to the bottom layer (get it fairly defocused, play around for taste) and then bring down the opacity of the top, regular layer allowing some of the defocused layer to come through. This can add halation and softening to your image. Again, it's not quite like using a bpm, but it's something else to try.

Posted Image

Can look something like this. A little dreamy, but that isn't always a bad thing! :D

Cheers!
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#10 Jim Feldspar

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Posted 04 January 2007 - 05:51 PM

Well, David and Stuart pretty well summed this one up, but allow me to present another option.

You can achieve a similar effect, though not exact by doing the stacked slide trick.

It goes like this: Take your video, and make a copy of it as a layer underneath. Add a blur to the bottom layer (get it fairly defocused, play around for taste) and then bring down the opacity of the top, regular layer allowing some of the defocused layer to come through. This can add halation and softening to your image. Again, it's not quite like using a bpm, but it's something else to try.

Posted Image

Can look something like this. A little dreamy, but that isn't always a bad thing! :D

Cheers!

I'm going right into Final Cut Express and check that out! Thanks.
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