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Lens/Stock combinations


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#1 Milo Sekulovich

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Posted 22 January 2007 - 04:18 AM

Hi,

I 'm currently shooting a feature in 35mm. It's a supernatural thriller.
We've been using a variety of stocks,but I've mainly been sticking to Kodak
5218 and Fuji 8573 for night interiors. For exteriors we've used mainly 5245,5201, and
5205.

I'm using older glass-Angenieux 25-250 zoom, 18mm Kinoptik, and the classic 9.8mm Kinoptik.

The thing I've consistently been noticing is that these lenses combined with both the 500 ASA stocks just never seem to turn out as clean and crisp as they should. When I've gone to stocks a stop slower the look is better-more crisp and clean. We're talking same lighting condtions,and simlar exposures. And I realise that there's virtually no difference between the new 250 asa stocks and 500 asa stocks. I've read the MTF curves and RMS granularity. Not really enough to make a noticeable difference.

It's most apparent in the stuff I've shot with 5218-just no snap or crispness.

Everything else looks great. I always try to avoid shooting wide open with these lenses.

It's a strange phenomenon that has shown itself consistently.

Have any of you experienced a similar scenario?

Regards,
Milo Sekulovich
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#2 Max Jacoby

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Posted 22 January 2007 - 04:33 AM

I don't think the stock is the limiting factor in your case, it's the lenses which are pretty old.
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#3 Milo Sekulovich

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Posted 23 January 2007 - 03:44 AM

I don't think the stock is the limiting factor in your case, it's the lenses which are pretty old.



Max,

I realise the lenses are old, but I've seen stuff I've shot with them that look
fantastic. Even with 250 ASA stock.

It's a strange anomoly.

Milo
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#4 Kim Sargenius

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Posted 02 March 2007 - 10:33 AM

It's most apparent in the stuff I've shot with 5218-just no snap or crispness.

Everything else looks great. I always try to avoid shooting wide open with these lenses.



Hi Milo,

Some stupid questions to start with:

Are you shooting both '18 and '73 in the same scene under the same lighting? If not - could it be that the scenes you are shooting with the '73 has just that little bit more snap?

How have you been viewing your rushes?

Ignore all of the above if you've already been through all that :)

In my experience the '18 should if anything have just a little bit more snap and contrast than the '18.


HTH,

Kim
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#5 Tony Brown

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Posted 03 March 2007 - 07:36 PM

I agree I think you may be looking for something thats not there. I tend to use S4's with 5217 or 5218 95% of the time so maybe I'm lucky with that combo. However I tend to use old glass (cooke mk 1 25 - 250 amongst others) for beauty work and still find the current Kodal crop to be leauges ahead of 'other' stocks I see. It took me some time to adapt to the latitude of 12/17/18 but owuld never go back now.

Change your lenses
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#6 chuck colburn

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Posted 04 March 2007 - 01:39 PM

Are these lenses used with the same camea body all the time?
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#7 Stephen Williams

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Posted 04 March 2007 - 01:49 PM

Hi,

I'm using older glass-Angenieux 25-250 zoom,
Milo Sekulovich


Hi Milo,

I bought one of those lenses from Digital Domain on Ebay for $300. At T8 it's O.K. I ended up taking it to pieces to use as a prop, did not seem worth a couple of hours to put it back together! LOL.

Stephen
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#8 Jon Kukla

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Posted 04 March 2007 - 03:55 PM

I don't understand the nature of your question - why is it so surprising that slower stocks and newer lenses should give "better"/"snappier" images?
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#9 Milo Sekulovich

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Posted 05 March 2007 - 06:17 PM

Hi,

Thanks for all of the replies.

I realise I'm using older glass. Not as sharp as modern lenses,
not as good contrast.

The Angenieux 25-250mm T3.9 zoom has been much
maligned but this lens can still produce fantastic images.

This is the crux of my point:

For some reason '18 doesn't seem to have any "snap" when using this older glass.

The zoom using slightly slower stocks (i.e., 250asa) looks great.
Similar lighting setups,stop,contrast etc.

And there shouldn't be that much of a difference between the 2 stocks.

I'm using an Arri 2C in a Cine 60 blimp. I know,I'm a throwback.

I shot a scene with the 25-250 in a park backlit with golden sunshine.
Fuji 250D Eterna at T5.6 and I must say it looks as good as the majority of things
I've seen shot with modern lenses.

My footage is being transferred on a Spirit. Dailies viewed on DVcam.

Perhaps I'm reading too much into this,but it's a constant phenomenon.
Could be the batch of '18,variances in telecine etc.

I'll post some screen captures.

Thanks,
Milo Sekulovich
DP/Equinox-Pinnacle Film Productions
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