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bolex H8 to 16mm-halfperf


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#1 Bernhard Zitz

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 06:12 AM

I intent to convert a bolex H8 to 16mm-halfperf by widening the gate using a recentered 16mm lens and shooting on double8 stock...

has anyone done this before or has some ideas to share...

cheers, Bernhard
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#2 Glenn Brady

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 07:46 AM

Ruedi Muster did something similar with DS8 stock, creating the so-called DS8 Breitwand format, although it seems he used an H16 RX and not H8 RX camera (thus avoiding the need to re-center the lens). See http://www.super8sit.../r_muster.shtml.
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#3 Herb Montes

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 12:00 PM

I have considered doing this myself. I thought of using the front turret from a non-reflex H16 in place of the one on the H8 since the mounting holes look the same. I have two H8s to work with but haven't gotten around to getting an H16 yet. Though I may consider using the front from my M4 as an experiment.
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#4 Ian Marks

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 01:09 PM

I had a similar idea, but intended to start with a 16mm Rex4. I went as far as getting an estimate from JK/Meritex, but the overall cost was essentially the same as converting the camera to Super 16. There's a thread here about it somewhere. What about telecine? how are you going to get from your half-height wide aspect ratio film to tape or disk?
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#5 Nick Mulder

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 02:45 AM

I dont understand how a H16 (rx4 etc...) would be useful as its pull-down is full frame ...
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#6 Bernhard Zitz

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 09:21 AM

What about telecine? how are you going to get from your half-height wide aspect ratio film to tape or disk?

I don't know yet, it should be possible to do this on modern telecine machines like spirit or rank, if I'm not wrong these machines don't have any claws or similar so they can run unsplittet D8 film through them. I don't know how much you can squeeze and scale it, best would be to end with a 2xsqueezed 4/3 SD. For projection you would simply ad a 2x anamorphic adapter in front of your videoprojector.
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#7 Patrick Neary

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 11:52 AM

I dont understand how a H16 (rx4 etc...) would be useful as its pull-down is full frame ...


Hi-

You would essentially have a gate that blocks out the top (or bottom) half of the 16 (double perf) frame, shoot once, then flip the roll of film (just like with reg. 8) and expose again- then do the same in telecine, cropping for the half frame.

The question with using regular 8 is whether a spirit could register or "pull-down" a half-frame at a time.

And why in the world you'd shoot regular-8 if you could afford a spirit! :)
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#8 Nick Mulder

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 12:01 PM

Hi-

You would essentially have a gate that blocks out the top (or bottom) half of the 16 (double perf) frame, shoot once, then flip the roll of film (just like with reg. 8) and expose again- then do the same in telecine, cropping for the half frame.

The question with using regular 8 is whether a spirit could register or "pull-down" a half-frame at a time.

And why in the world you'd shoot regular-8 if you could afford a spirit! :)


right, cool - and you wouldnt have all those potential realignment problems that stop this from being reliable in the 35mm version (I remember a thread about it a month or so back) - its a bit early in the morning for me to get my thinking cap properly adjusted but you could use standard 16mm single-side normal pitch film also

you'd still have to recentre the lens though or you'd have an effective shift on all your shots...

still an H8 version is just as viable ? (still need a recentre and the D8 film though)
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#9 Nick Mulder

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 12:41 PM

its a bit early in the morning for me to get my thinking cap properly adjusted but you could use standard 16mm single-side normal pitch film also

Had a shower, realized it was indeed a bit too early in the morning ... :rolleyes:

However - if you were stuck with single sided film you could have a system with a half gate that had slotted screw mounts that could slide up and down to either the top or bottom position (and lens also, so you actually end up with a dial-in shift lens system) - youd have to rewind the film after the first run before running the reel again (with the new gate position) - if you caught the reel before it ran fully out of the claw mechanism and your camera had a rewind function and you could somehow realign the gate from outside the camera (where there is a will there is a way!) you wouldnt even need to open it B)

More machining and you have to rewind your reel, but you have the extra 'super16' area that the double sprockets would have otherwise taken up = wider aspect (and the normal film advantage)

I've got an old bolex here I'm about to super16 - I might try it but just put some tape over the gate and live with the shift until I work on the lens recentre...
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#10 Leo Anthony Vale

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 03:37 PM

I intent to convert a bolex H8 to 16mm-halfperf by widening the gate using a recentered 16mm lens and shooting on double8 stock...

has anyone done this before or has some ideas to share...

cheers, Bernhard


Tony Shapps at the widescreen-centre as some experience with this set up.

http://www.widescreen-centre.co.uk/
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#11 Bernhard Zitz

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 06:39 AM

You would essentially have a gate that blocks out the top (or bottom) half of the 16 (double perf) frame, shoot once, then flip the roll of film (just like with reg. 8) and expose again- then do the same in telecine, cropping for the half frame.

I use the D8-mechanism and D8 film, the camera moves one D8 frame per step that's a half a 16mm...no need to flip the film...

The question with using regular 8 is whether a spirit could register or "pull-down" a half-frame at a time.

normaly the machine triggers at each new perforation, it ignores the distance between the holes, it should retrigger at each D8 perforation

And why in the world you'd shoot regular-8 if you could afford a spirit! :)

that's an argument, maybe for the challenge :D

knows anyone how the bosch fdl-60 works, I have a really cheap deal on such a machine...

cheers, Bernhard
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