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Shooting S16mm at night


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#1 Vincent De Paula

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 04:06 AM

Hi guys,
I am filming a Feature Film in S16mm in London next month.
We'll be shooting everything at night since the action happens between 2am and 6am in the morning. I will be bringing come chinese lanterns for the EXT shots in the street at night since there won't be a big budget for other sources. There are street lamps that I will be very happy to use as well.
I have used 7218 stock extensively in the past although always in a more controlled situation where I always had enough lighting fixtures.
I am a bit concerned mainly about the size of the grain shooting in such low light enviroments. Also I will be relying on Canon zoom lenses mostly, and the widest I can go is T/2.4.
I usually rate this stock at 320 ASA and have been quite happy with the results.
I will most likely use 7217 for the INT shots.
Have you guys use 7218 in a similar lighting situation?

Thanks

Vincent De Paula
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#2 Michael Nash

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 04:42 AM

Check out this thread:

http://www.cinematog...showtopic=21258
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#3 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 12:28 PM

7218 at 320 ASA will look great, but at T/2.4 and 320 ASA, you will be lighting your night exteriors up more than you would like to...
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#4 Adam Frisch FSF

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 12:37 PM

Beg, steal and borrow to try and get soem T1.3 primes - that will do a big difference. Those extra 2 stops will make the night exteriors and the ambience look that more convincing. Also, the Canon's are not that fantastic in my opinion, especially not wide open.
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#5 Robert G Andrews

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 12:53 PM

Vincent De Paula:

I'm in London, when and where will you be shooting? Just interested, that's all...'fraid I don't know the answer to your technical-related question but more than happy to give input on the creative side, story, direction etc...if asked, of course...what's the plot?

Robert
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#6 John Thomas

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 01:02 PM

Beg, steal and borrow to try and get soem T1.3 primes - that will do a big difference. Those extra 2 stops will make the night exteriors and the ambience look that more convincing. Also, the Canon's are not that fantastic in my opinion, especially not wide open.


Don't think twice about it, go out and rent some fast, sharp primes. And get a good focus puller.

75mm_T2.0_5218_through_window.JPG 75mm, 5218, T2.0 through window
150mm_T2.0_5218_through_window.JPG 150mm, 5218, T2.0 through window
150mm_T2.0_5218_through_a_window.JPG 150mm, 5218, T2.0 through window
100mm_T3.6_5218_no_window.JPG 100mm, 5218, T3.6 no window
150mm_T3.6_5218_no_window.JPG 150mm, 5218, T3.6 no window

As you can see, not only shooting with a fast lens, but choosing your BG is very important. I could have used a faster prime here. When we went closer I had to stop down :( to give the AC a chance to get it into focus. With some shots, the difference of 2 inches of DOF and 4 inches is huge.
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#7 Vincent De Paula

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Posted 11 March 2007 - 04:27 AM

Thanks guys,
I'll be trying to get some faster lenses but I think we'll be end up using the Canon zoom lenses...
If that's the case I want to make sure I can get as many possible sources as I can.
John, thanks for the grabs, although the depth of field and the grain will obviously be different with 7218 and S16mm. What sources did you have on that particular shot?
There will be some establishing wide shots in Waterloo bridge, and then I'll be moving closer to follow a girl being chased and I will be using longer lenses for that chase and some handhold work. The rest of the night EXT shots are going to be easier to handle and I will be following the actors with moving sources.

We'll start filming in about 3 weeks now, and I'll let you guys know what's happening...
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#8 Vincent De Paula

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Posted 11 March 2007 - 04:44 AM

I have now managed to get hold of a 9.5mm Zeiss Distagon T 1.3...
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#9 timHealy

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Posted 11 March 2007 - 06:17 AM

I have now managed to get hold of a 9.5mm Zeiss Distagon T 1.3...


I agree about using a set of fast lenses, but beware of wide open with wide lenses. Focus becomes extremely critical. It may look in focus through the viewfinder but won't be. Use extra extra care, more light and a great AC.

best

Tim
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#10 John Thomas

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Posted 11 March 2007 - 12:34 PM

I agree about using a set of fast lenses, but beware of wide open with wide lenses. Focus becomes extremely critical. It may look in focus through the viewfinder but won't be. Use extra extra care, more light and a great AC.

best

Tim


Tim's right, wide angle lenses can burn you badly. Even stopped down..

A lot of "fast" lenses don't look great opened up all of the way. Better dark but sharp. I tried a 50mm T1.0 lens wide open once, OOPS.

Vincent, I used a single tungsten soft source on the actors and just went with the lights in the distance. Even when stopped down, if you can keep an out of focus light in the BG that is brighter than the actor's faces, you'll be OK. When there's nothing behind them, it's pretty bad. I'll look for a 7218 night grab.
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#11 Dan Salzmann

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Posted 11 March 2007 - 01:09 PM

Do get a set of faster primes because with the Canon zoom you probably won't have enough exposure on the background especially in the wide shots.
It also will not be sharp wide open.
7218 and a diffused Joker light or two for the rest.
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#12 Vincent De Paula

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Posted 14 March 2007 - 12:43 PM

Thanks evryone for the input.
I'll rely more than I initially though on the wide Zeiss lense, but will REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY try to get some more Primes of these series...
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#13 Chris Keth

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Posted 15 March 2007 - 10:32 AM

Thanks evryone for the input.
I'll rely more than I initially though on the wide Zeiss lense, but will REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY try to get some more Primes of these series...



I'm reasonably certain that that pime won't cover super 16. Make sure ou check it in a bright room. You may not be able to notice vignetting outdoors in hen dark until you get a surprise from the lab.
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