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red camlera delivery starts, next products: 4k projector, ultracompact red and 4k displays. prime lens set.


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#1 jan von krogh

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 03:33 PM

the 4k displays and projectors as well as the minired have no precise info atm, information about them was given in direct interviews inly so far.

the camera delivery is starting this april. our first will be 07/2007, second 09/2007.

they aim for over 3500 cameras to be delivered in 2007.

the red zoom now costs 5900/6500 USD, its 18-50F2.8, arri pl mount. s35 coverage. i suppose we will stay with our several angenieux zooms, however the price is incredible - we will see LOTS of these zooms i suppose.

prime set is 5 lenses, 4@f1.9, one at f2.8, complete set is 19.995$. i think we will skip this and stay with our 1.2 zeiss-set, however the price/performace ratio is outstanding here as well.

orders seem to -flood- in at nab, stampede @ the red booth.

http://www.studiodai.../news/7959.html
has some nice sum ups.

this is indeed a historical day. 4k digital cinemaproduction as the new standard has begun.
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#2 Scott Fritzshall

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 03:44 PM

This is the most amazing thing ever. No event in history has ever been this important. Please, Jan, make a new thread for every single word that Jim Jannard utters; I simply don't think you've made enough.

In all seriousness, this is neat, and I'm interested to see how this all turns out. I just think we can do with less breathless amazement at every single thing that RED does, and I certainly don't think we need a new thread for them all either.
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#3 Stephen Williams

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 03:50 PM

the 4k displays and projectors as well as the minired have no precise info atm, information about them was given in direct interviews inly so far.

the camera delivery is starting this april. our first will be 07/2007, second 09/2007.

they aim for over 3500 cameras to be delivered in 2007.

the red zoom now costs 5900/6500 USD, its 18-50F2.8, arri pl mount. s35 coverage. i suppose we will stay with our several angenieux zooms, however the price is incredible - we will see LOTS of these zooms i suppose.

prime set is 5 lenses, 4@f1.9, one at f2.8, complete set is 19.995$. i think we will skip this and stay with our 1.2 zeiss-set, however the price/performace ratio is outstanding here as well.

orders seem to -flood- in at nab, stampede @ the red booth.

http://www.studiodai.../news/7959.html
has some nice sum ups.

this is indeed a historical day. 4k digital cinemaproduction as the new standard has begun.


wow! if only there were 3500 good scripts a year.
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#4 jan von krogh

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 03:53 PM

This is the most amazing thing ever. No event in history has ever been this important. Please, Jan, make a new thread for every single word that Jim Jannard utters; I simply don't think you've made enough.

In all seriousness, this is neat, and I'm interested to see how this all turns out. I just think we can do with less breathless amazement at every single thing that RED does, and I certainly don't think we need a new thread for them all either.


Dear scott, this is why i summarized all the new products in one thread. that is today. apple supporting red was yesterday. and peter jackson deserves his own thread, as he is as well no red employee but volouteered to shoot the first red 4k shortfilm.

sheer madness at nab btw, quoting mike seymour of fxguide.com....

"The orders are flooding in - the queues are out the booth round the corner and down the hall to get in. Jim is greeting everyone in the 4K cinema and of course the booth is extremely busy."
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#5 Eric Steelberg ASC

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:04 PM

wow! if only there were 3500 good scripts a year.



THANK YOU FOR SAYING IT STEPHEN.
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#6 jan von krogh

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:06 PM

so, more new products

# Canon EOS lens mount produced by Birger Engineering and Red
# SuperGrip - a variation upon the current handles available for the RedRail/Cage setups, including remote control of Canon EOS lens mount as well as...
# Red Motor, seems to be a motorized follow focus since and is listed along with the SuperGrip as a lens accessory.

hmmm, one 8 man startup takes on arri, panavision, panavision, sony, zeiss, cooke and angenieux at once and sells like mad and has peter jackson volounteering to shot their promos... 18 months ago i would judged anyone who told me so nuts, now its reality.
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#7 Galen Carter-Jeffrey

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:15 PM

Before I left, RED dropped another little tidbit of information on me: Jim Jannard and Jarred Land had just returned from two days of shooting with two of the RED camera prototypes, ?Boris? and ?Natasha.? Returned from where? From New Zealand, where they were shooting with Peter Jackson, Oscar-winning Director of the Lord of the Rings trilogy



:lol:
It's written like we don't know who Peter Jackson is.
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#8 jan von krogh

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:15 PM

wow! if only there were 3500 good scripts a year.


sadly most movies have rather mediocre scripts, however, i don´t think that the red cameras here will only shoot one feature a year and on the other hand, using 8 or more cameras for features is pretty usual.

also, i think we can be pretty sure that not all 3500 cameras will see cinematic feature work, commercials, clips, gfx and even postpropeople seem to be a solid part of the buyers.

also, 3500 cameras is just 2007 and not counting the pocketred which, as the 4k projector and the 4k display has no delivery date at this moment. all other products however are on delivery this april or starting to be delivered until end of the year.

i have only guesstimates for the sales of the newer arris, but i would be really curious how many 235 and 416 have been sold.

i hope arri now finally wakes up, its really about time now. since 6 years i tell them every single tradeshow that i want to buy a digital arri, not rent - and the d20 is no match for the red in almost any aspect. hope its no too late for them now and they have something up their sleeves

would hate to see after steenbeck, leica, bosch broadcast, dual, grundig etc another once champion world-class manufacturer being reduced or worse because they didn´t adapt to digital.
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#9 jan von krogh

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:27 PM

here are some photos of the booth. the waiting line goes down the hall until the exit and they have bouncers at the door to let the people in in groups.

http://zakforrest.co...nab/rednab.html
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#10 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:34 PM

hmmm, one 8 man startup takes on arri, panavision, panavision, sony, zeiss, cooke and angenieux at once and sells like mad and has peter jackson volunteering to shot their promos... 18 months ago i would judged anyone who told me so nuts, now its reality.


Yeah, I bet they're shitting themselves.

Now that the RED camera is a reality, can't you come clean, Jan? You DO work for them, don't you....?

<_<
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#11 jan von krogh

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:44 PM

Yeah, I bet they're shitting themselves.

Now that the RED camera is a reality, can't you come clean, Jan? You DO work for them, don't you....?

<_<


no, i am just a customer for 2 cameras for our production and rental, which i have to fully pay for, besides the $5,000 bonus we got as early customer - but red gave anyone who preordered $2.500 for free shopping, ludwig in munich has 12.500$ for his 5 cams :)

rental seems to become quite interesting with red one. right now we are pretty undecided how we will price red, but it seems that the reds will be the fastest breakeven we ever had in 17 years with any camera, crashcams not included.

besides, red has 9 employees at this moment in time. i think we can assume that there will be -some- additional jobs created this very moment.
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#12 Alexander Joyce

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:51 PM

and the d20 is no match for the red in almost any aspect.


I'd like to hear you back up this statement..

the D20 for instance is built around components that have proven themselves in the field for several years, it's a modular design that makes it easily upgradable when ARRI release a new back for it, it's chip is also physically larger than the Red's.
ARRI might not be the first to jump onto the 4K craze that seems to have hit everyone, but when they eventually do it, it will most likely be done the right way.
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#13 Max Jacoby

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 04:54 PM

I don't give a flying fu** how many people work there. Stop acting like Red the best thing since sliced bread and is going to 'anihilate' everyone else. Arri, Panavision, Kodak and Fuji and other manufacturers are still going to be here in the future. Different people need different solutions/equipment. Red might be the best option for you, but that does not mean everyone has those same requirements also. You're really getting on everyone's nerves with your silly 'predicitons' and championing of a product that you don't even had the opportunity to test for yourself.
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#14 Tenolian Bell

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 05:02 PM

they aim for over 3500 cameras to be delivered in 2007.


The other shoe will drop at some point. Electronics is a tricky industry. Its can be very difficult to engineer a new product with few manufacturing defects. Then roll out large orders of the product and have them work reliably.

Arri and Panavision usually do extensive tests of their gear before they do a large roll out. Arri tested the Arricam for a couple of years before it began taking a lot of orders for the camera.
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#15 David Sweetman

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 05:09 PM

Nah, I heard it's still a hoax. Jim fills up the screening room, then says "So...who's heard about scientology?"
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#16 Andrew Ray

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 05:10 PM

Jan, did you get my mail?
I need your rental business tel#
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#17 jan von krogh

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 05:13 PM

I'd like to hear you back up this statement..

the D20 for instance is built around components that have proven themselves in the field for several years, it's a modular design that makes it easily upgradable when ARRI release a new back for it, it's chip is also physically larger than the Red's.
ARRI might not be the first to jump onto the 4K craze that seems to have hit everyone, but when they eventually do it, it will most likely be done the right way.


arris camera has less resolution.
D20
3100 x 2200 grid, used 2880 x 1620 pixel grid, out converted to 1920 x 1080 resolution, 4:3 aspect sensor.
RED
4900 x 2580 grid, used 4520 x 2540 pixelgrid, full out as RAW, S35 aspect sensor

arri d20 sensor has
6 megapixel
RED
12 megapixel

has less fps
D20
1-60fps
RED
1-120fps

D20 has only
duallink HD-SDI
RED has this as well, but it only can transmit 25% of the image, additionally there is the rawport for uncompressed out, disk, cf, flash etc for 4k redcode

D20 has only a streamlined HDCAMSR/diskrecorder workflow
RED can be edited native in 4k and can target to -any- quicktime/video for windows/cineon etc compliant application via redcine.

ARRI
7 kg
RED
4.5 KG

arri is pretty large and bulky, red is compact, not much larger than a hvx200 as reference.

ARRI D20 has only HD-SDI or RAW
RED has HD-SDI, RAW and several waveletbasing compressions

D20 is a Camerahead, not a camcorder
RED is a camcorder with integrated recording

arri rental only, quite expensive, costing $$$$ a day
red rental or buy, revolutionary price, rental will be $$$. so for some one or two week worth of shooting d20, you can easily buy a red.

D20 requires additional gear with high prices for recording (venon, hdcam sr deck etc)
RED doesn´t.

D20 can´t uses off-the-shelf media
RED can use compact flash, Expresscard etc etc.

no pun intended- i can´t find a single specification in which D20 has any advantage over the red.











Jan, did you get my mail?
I need your rental business tel#


sorry, my pm folder is flooded - will respond asap via PM.
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#18 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 05:34 PM

arris camera has less resolution.
D20
3100 x 2200 grid, used 2880 x 1620 pixel grid, out converted to 1920 x 1080 resolution, 4:3 aspect sensor.
RED
4900 x 2580 grid, used 4520 x 2540 pixelgrid, full out as RAW, S35 aspect sensor

arri d20 sensor has
6 megapixel
RED
12 megapixel

has less fps
D20
1-60fps
RED
1-120fps

D20 has only
duallink HD-SDI
RED has this as well, but it only can transmit 25% of the image, additionally there is the rawport for uncompressed out, disk, cf, flash etc for 4k redcode

D20 has only a streamlined HDCAMSR/diskrecorder workflow
RED can be edited native in 4k and can target to -any- quicktime/video for windows/cineon etc compliant application via redcine.

ARRI
7 kg
RED
4.5 KG

arri is pretty large and bulky, red is compact, not much larger than a hvx200 as reference.

ARRI D20 has only HD-SDI or RAW
RED has HD-SDI, RAW and several waveletbasing compressions

D20 is a Camerahead, not a camcorder
RED is a camcorder with integrated recording

arri rental only, quite expensive, costing $$$$ a day
red rental or buy, revolutionary price, rental will be $$$. so for some one or two week worth of shooting d20, you can easily buy a red.

D20 requires additional gear with high prices for recording (venon, hdcam sr deck etc)
RED doesn´t.

D20 can´t uses off-the-shelf media
RED can use compact flash, Expresscard etc etc.

no pun intended- i can´t find a single specification in which D20 has any advantage over the red.
sorry, my pm folder is flooded - will respond asap via PM.


And, up until today, RED did not officially exist.

And, is still completely untried and untested.

Jan, if you are as experienced as you say in the world of Rental equipment, then you should know that each product finds it's market, and that no single product serves all needs. Quit the flag waving and let RED (finally) speak for itself.
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#19 jan von krogh

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 05:47 PM

Stop acting like Red the best thing since sliced bread and is going to 'anihilate' everyone else.

i think this decision is up to the buyers, and the figures speak for themself.

Arri, Panavision, Kodak and Fuji and other manufacturers are still going to be here in the future.

yound padawan, i have seen ampex as so many other once incredibly huge corps going down..... and i wouldn´t put arri & panavision together with kodak & fuji in one basket. kodaks main business is already digital, and arri & panavision are pretty small companys compared to kodak.

so, let me quote the CEO of kodak.

Antonio Perez, its chief executive, asserts: "Soon, I'm not going to be answering questions about film because I won't know. It will be too small for me to get involved."

http://us.ft.com/ftg...id=yahoofinance

You're really getting on everyone's nerves with your silly 'predicitons' and championing of a product that you don't even had the opportunity to test for yourself.

this might apply to you, but certainly not for the members of the board who send me pms because they want to rent red asap.

however, if you don´t like discussion about red, then leave the red subforum please.
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#20 Dan Goulder

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Posted 16 April 2007 - 05:50 PM

rental seems to become quite interesting with red one. right now we are pretty undecided how we will price red, but it seems that the reds will be the fastest breakeven we ever had in 17 years with any camera, crashcams not included.

Please share with us the name of your rental company, and the web address. After all, with so many European members on this forum, it would be an obvious place to pick up business.
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