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P+S lenses - the choice for low budget red heads?


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#1 Keith Mottram

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Posted 25 April 2007 - 08:00 AM

P+S digi lenses

At $2200 dollars a piece these good be a good low budget option and are faster 85mm and 50mm than red's offerings...
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#2 Luke Prendergast

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Posted 25 April 2007 - 05:58 PM

It appears they are Zeiss ZF lenses with a bigger housing and a focus gear. Direct from Zeiss the ZFs start at ~$680USD so for triple the price I'd be hoping P+S have done more than what appears to be just a very simple mechanical modification. P+S are listing the T-stop the same as Zeiss are the F-stop so I think they've made a mistake there.
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#3 Stephen Williams

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Posted 26 April 2007 - 02:55 AM

P+S are listing the T-stop the same as Zeiss are the F-stop so I think they've made a mistake there.


Hi Luke,

Zeiss did the same with MK 1 SuperSpeeds, not all the lenses in the set were as fast as stated!

Stephen
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#4 chuck colburn

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Posted 26 April 2007 - 12:17 PM

I think they still focus backwards which is tough on the puller if you don't have a follow focus device which is reversable.
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#5 jan von krogh

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Posted 29 April 2007 - 01:44 AM

we will use our 2 reds with our "classic" zeiss 1.2 primeset, our 1994' cooke primes and our 5 angenieux zooms, FWIW.

i hope they all pass the 4k CA challenge.
we´ll see.
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#6 Francis De Marco

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Posted 28 June 2007 - 05:30 PM

we will use our 2 reds with our "classic" zeiss 1.2 primeset, our 1994' cooke primes and our 5 angenieux zooms, FWIW.

i hope they all pass the 4k CA challenge.
we´ll see.

I heard Red is coming with a 50-150mm T/2.8, PL mount I guess. Any idea about price and delivery?
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#7 Gary McClurg

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Posted 28 June 2007 - 09:51 PM

P+S digi lenses

At $2200 dollars a piece these good be a good low budget option and are faster 85mm and 50mm than red's offerings...


Yeah I thought that was the price at NAB also but now they raised the price...

The 25mm, 35mm & 50mm are now $2,700 each and the 85mm is $3,100... the reasoning is that that price at NAB was probably Euro's...

Yeah right... :(
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#8 Francis De Marco

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Posted 29 June 2007 - 05:08 PM

It appears they are Zeiss ZF lenses with a bigger housing and a focus gear. Direct from Zeiss the ZFs start at ~$680USD so for triple the price I'd be hoping P+S have done more than what appears to be just a very simple mechanical modification. P+S are listing the T-stop the same as Zeiss are the F-stop so I think they've made a mistake there.


I don't blame P+S charging 3 times the price of the Zeiss optics as long as they did a good job. A friend who works a Panavision thinks Red is modifying Sigma EX zooms like Panavision did with Minolta, they are at $600 retail price. If it's true Red makes a significant margin on these lenses.
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#9 Stephen Williams

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 01:29 AM

I don't blame P+S charging 3 times the price of the Zeiss optics as long as they did a good job. A friend who works a Panavision thinks Red is modifying Sigma EX zooms like Panavision did with Minolta, they are at $600 retail price. If it's true Red makes a significant margin on these lenses.


Hi,

There is a huge amount of work to turn a still zoom lens into a cine lens, $4995 is very cheap for the conversion alone asuming it's well done.

People have paid far more than that for prime lens conversions in the past.

Stephen
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#10 Luke Prendergast

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 02:39 AM

For a full lens conversion, yes the dollars may be reasonable, but if all they've done is put the lens in a bigger barrel with more convenient markings and a focus gear, I don't think the tripling in price is reasonable. It's still Nikon mount isn't it? Still focusses the wrong way? I haven't laid hands on the P+S lenses, but they look like the same lens in a shell, rather than a converted lens. There is too little detail on the P+S site to tell exactly what they've done.
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#11 Gary McClurg

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 06:54 AM

For a full lens conversion, yes the dollars may be reasonable, but if all they've done is put the lens in a bigger barrel with more convenient markings and a focus gear, I don't think the tripling in price is reasonable. It's still Nikon mount isn't it? Still focusses the wrong way? I haven't laid hands on the P+S lenses, but they look like the same lens in a shell, rather than a converted lens. There is too little detail on the P+S site to tell exactly what they've done.


Here's the best way to tell...

http://www.zeiss.com/photo

Then click on the picture of the ZF lens... or here's a better link... with prices...

https://photo-shop.z...es/Objektive/ZF

Now the P & S primes...

http://www.zgc.com/z...71?OpenDocument

To me its not so much that the prime set costs $11.7k... its the fact that I do not like someone giving me information... saying it costs $8.8k and then when they're ready to sell them... oops now there $2.9k higher... I could see a $500 jump... maybe a grand... but not $3k... then also tell me "well the $2.2k was in Euros"... like I always ask for the Euro price because I have plenty of them sitting around in my US bank account... lol...

Can't think of their name... somethinig like Visual Pursuit... in the midwest... Chicago I think... but they had a set for sale (total of 5 lens not 4) for sale... now if I can just find the link or remember the correct name...

Edited by Gary McClurg, 30 June 2007 - 06:58 AM.

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#12 chuck colburn

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 07:25 AM

Here you go

http://www.visualproducts.com/
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#13 Gary McClurg

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 08:32 AM

Here you go

http://www.visualproducts.com/



Thanks Chuck...

Found something interesting... going through my NAB stuff found a post card sized price list from ZGC... they list two Cooke 35mm to Super 16 Zoom lens conversions from P & S...

RU953 - 18-100mm, T3 to 9.5-53mm, T1.6 new for $14k...
RU1052 - 20-100mm, T3 to 10.6-180mm, T1.65 new for $14k...

Just wondering if they could just do the conversion to a lower t stop...
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#14 chuck colburn

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 09:04 AM

Thanks Chuck...

Found something interesting... going through my NAB stuff found a post card sized price list from ZGC... they list two Cooke 35mm to Super 16 Zoom lens conversions from P & S...

RU953 - 18-100mm, T3 to 9.5-53mm, T1.6 new for $14k...
RU1052 - 20-100mm, T3 to 10.6-180mm, T1.65 new for $14k...

Just wondering if they could just do the conversion to a lower t stop...


Hi Gary,

Yeah they been doing that for a while. If I understand it right it's a replacement of the rear optical group (sometimes referd to as the collimating group) which allows for a larger effective aperture. I don't believe it's possible to increase the stop of the standard rear end. But I've been known to be wrong! lol

Chuck

http://www.zgc.com/z...69?OpenDocument

Edited by chuck colburn, 30 June 2007 - 09:05 AM.

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#15 Stephen Williams

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 09:35 AM

Thanks Chuck...

Found something interesting... going through my NAB stuff found a post card sized price list from ZGC... they list two Cooke 35mm to Super 16 Zoom lens conversions from P & S...

RU953 - 18-100mm, T3 to 9.5-53mm, T1.6 new for $14k...
RU1052 - 20-100mm, T3 to 10.6-180mm, T1.65 new for $14k...

Just wondering if they could just do the conversion to a lower t stop...


Hi Gary,

Cooke converts the lenses themselves, not P+S!

It's not possible to get the faster stop & have a lens that covers 35mm format. Think of adding a teleconverter to a lens the focal length gets longer & the stop gets smaller. (The Cooke conversion is NOT a negative converter, but as Chuck says it's the collimating group that gets changed.

Stephen
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#16 Gary McClurg

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 10:03 AM

Yeah... figured I'd be out of luck on the conversation...

And the set of Zeiss f1.4 primes that Visual Products had sold... I think the asking price was $14.5k... a few grand over the P & S... but all faster stops... plus I think the set was 24mm, 35mm, 50mm, 85mm and 100mm... where the P & S do not have the 35mm... so really if you break it down about the same price...

Wrong camera forum here... but was looking for a nice good set of primes to maybe go with an HPX 500 and Pro 35...

There is a company called RPLens that does Nikon conversations... about $375 a lens if you send them the lens... he has a set of Nikon retooled for the Mini 35 for about $3,400 to $3,500.... all around f2... then a set of Canon's I believe all around f1.4's except for the 50mm which if I remember right f2...

Wondering if the ZF lens are the ones that P & S converted or had done for their new primes that we've been talking about...

Edited by Gary McClurg, 30 June 2007 - 10:07 AM.

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#17 Gary McClurg

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 10:18 AM

A mistake on my part...

The P&S are 25mm,35mm,50mm and 85mm... so Visual Products had the extra 100mm
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#18 chuck colburn

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 10:36 AM

Hey Gary , how does one edit a post?

thanks
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#19 Stephen Williams

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 11:00 AM

And the set of Zeiss f1.4 primes that Visual Products had sold... I think the asking price was $14.5k... a few grand over the P & S... but all faster stops... plus I think the set was 24mm, 35mm, 50mm, 85mm and 100mm... where the P & S do not have the 35mm... so really if you break it down about the same price...

Wondering if the ZF lens are the ones that P & S converted or had done for their new primes that we've been talking about...


Hi Gary,

The MK 1 Superspeeds are about 30 years old & not loved because of their 3 iris blade bokah. Thats why there are only $14.5 (2 years ago about half that would have bought you a good set)

P+S is rehousing the ZF Lenses.

Until Red lenses have been tested & proove themselves, motion picture lenses will remain high, but could fall like a brick if Red lenses turn out to be as good as the companies marketing.

Stephen
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#20 Gary McClurg

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Posted 30 June 2007 - 11:16 AM

Thanks Stephen...

Chuck didn't see your edit a post "post" till now... on the right bottom side of the post box there should be edit or modify... there is a way to go back and re-edit post later... but you have to be a gold member or can't think what you call it... the other way you can only edit once or twice... or I think if someone posts after you... you can't fix it...

Edited by Gary McClurg, 30 June 2007 - 11:18 AM.

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