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What's the difference?


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#1 Julia Gers

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 12:24 PM

This might be a stupid question, but...
what's the real difference between all these: ASC, DoP, videographer, cinematographer, and cameraman?
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#2 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 12:35 PM

This might be a stupid question, but...
what's the real difference between all these: ASC, DoP, videographer, cinematographer, and cameraman?


I'm sure there must be a joke answer somewhere, like "about $500 a day."

There are somewhat political issues that I won't go into, but my own personal definitions are:

DoP, or DP: Director of Photography. Same thing as cinematographer, but technically Director of Photography is the union job title for the cinematographer, but non-union cinematographers use the title as well.

ASC: American Society of Cinematographers. An honorary society (not a union) of cinematographers, membership by invitation only. Tends to be composed of the more prominent cinematographers in the film industry, but somehow I snuck in. Other countries have their own version, like the BSC, ACS, HKSC, etc. Other job categories have their own honorary society too, like ACE for editors. Some societies can be joined just by paying a fee and providing a list of professional credits, others require letters of recommendation and a committee review.

Videographer: someone specifically using video equipment for photography. I think of it as a subset of the broader term cinematographer, which really just means a photographer of moving images (cinema, as opposed to still photography), regardless of the medium used.

Cameraman is an older sex-specific title for anyone using the movie camera -- technically it's the cinematographer, but camera operators and camera assistants have also been called cameramen (if they are men.)
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#3 Julia Gers

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 01:51 PM

Ohh, ok. Thanks! :)
If there is a videographer, than is there also someone called a "filmographer"? I've never heard it before, though... :rolleyes:
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#4 Tim Terner

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 02:45 PM

........DoP, or DP: Director of Photography. Same thing as cinematographer, but technically Director of Photography is the union job title for the cinematographer, but non-union cinematographers use the title as well.


So what about countries where the unions aren't so powerful David ? are there only cinematographers ?
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#5 Stephen Williams

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 04:01 PM

So what about countries where the unions aren't so powerful David ? are there only cinematographers ?


Hi,

In Switzerland there are only 39 'Film Kameramann' in the Union, to join, I just got 2 assistants (both members) to confirm that I was working as a DOP! There is so little film being shot you have to book film processing :lol:

Stephen
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#6 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 06:15 PM

Didn't I say that non-union cinematographers use the term Director of Photography too?

Other countries may have a different word entirely - they don't all use English terms!
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#7 Adam Frisch FSF

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 06:22 PM

Other countries have their own version, like the BSC, ACS, HKSC, etc.


You seem to willfully and deliberately omit the hugely influential Swedish FSF society in all your posts! I cannot feel but that you're out specifically to try to reduce my professional achievements!:D :P
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#8 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 06:26 PM

You seem to willfully and deliberately omit the hugely influential Swedish FSF society in all your posts! I cannot feel but that you're out specifically to try to reduce my professional achievements!:D :P


Sorry!

For some reason, "FSF" doesn't instantly spring to mind, partly because I don't know what the letters stand for. I assume "S" is for Swedish and one of the F's is for Film... maybe. So what does FSF stand for?
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#9 Matthew Buick

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 07:13 PM

It must be an incredible honour to be asked to join one of these incredible societies...

... David and Adam. What were your first reactions on hearing of your acceptance to your respective cinematographical (non-labour, non-union) entities? Did you both feel the rush of endorphines that is characteristic with this specific form of incresed status in your respective communities???

:lol:
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#10 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 07:17 PM

It was more of a drawn-out affair lasting about three months from the time I sent in my letters of recommendation to the time I was officially accepted, so I had time to acclimate to the idea. It was exciting, of course, especially while I was working, telling my camera crew (many of whom I had worked with over the years) of my progress in getting in.
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#11 Matthew Buick

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 07:27 PM

Must be great!

I held a presentation for my English GCSE recently. We had to pick a topic to share with the class. I picked my Sankyo CME 1100. I also brought along some stills blown up to 35mm of my first Super 8 film starring my dear little cat. The class were entralled by them (maybe it was just the cat) but I'm sure the accidental DoF in the stills had something to do with their success.

I'm hoping for an A*. ;)
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#12 Adam Frisch FSF

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 07:37 PM

I had to beg them to accept me. And threathen, cajole and blackmail two other members to recommend me! :D

FSF stands for Föreningen (Society) Sveriges (Swedish) Filmfotografer (Cinematographers).

No, in all seriousness - they used to have a policy that they only allowed cinematographers to join that had done at least 2 features. But that kind of
went out the window a couple of years ago. You still must have experience with shooting on film (don't know how long that will last) and be "proficient"
and at the "forefront of your profession", or something like that. Which should have ruled me out..

One down, two to go: I will not rest until I'm Adam Frisch, ASC, BSC, FSF! :) :blink:
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#13 Kenny N Suleimanagich

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 07:43 PM

Hah! Matthew, your story reminds me of when I had my light meter at school with me and my english teacher asked me to show it to the class. The initial reaction was, "why would you be so into measuring light?"
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#14 James Steven Beverly

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 08:40 PM

Ohh, ok. Thanks! :)
If there is a videographer, than is there also someone called a "filmographer"? I've never heard it before, though... :rolleyes:


I actually HAVE heard that term before NOT to discribe someone who shoots movies on film but to discribe someone who make documentery-style biographies, go figure. B)
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#15 Paul Sallent

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 07:45 AM

In general, because American and English people, got this art where it is now and evolved it to this extend,
the terminology is all in english almost everywhere.
When it's not it refers, to them in a way.
In Greece for example the black flack ( for cutiing the flares etc) it is called Americana ( as a female American).
Though all the terms derive from Latin and Greek.
Like Cinematographer (cinema derives from the word kinisis which is movement) and grapher (which is an add-on an not a proper word) derives from Grafo which is the verb for writing. So Cinematographer is the one who writes/captures the movement.
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#16 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 03:17 PM

Is this a self-portrait?

meqw2.jpg
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#17 Julia Gers

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 03:58 PM

Is this a self-portrait?

meqw2.jpg


Yep, it sure is. Although I love to draw and all that good stuff, I didn't draw this. A friend of mine drew it (her Deviantart site: http://pretzelqueen.deviantart.com/). Any time I've tried to draw a self portrait it just hasn't turned out all that well <_< . I've got some drawings up on my deviantart (http://lupinwolfy.deviantart.com/). Most of the stuff on there is photography. I'm actually in the midst of adding more pictures to it right now because I've kinda fallen behind on that.
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#18 Carlos_Martinez

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 05:25 PM

i cant wait til i get a chance of being a ASC is there a Mexican equivalent. On that note Does any one know who was the DP for "Amorres Perros" Loves a bitch (US translation)?
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#19 Matthew Buick

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 05:26 PM

Hah! Matthew, your story reminds me of when I had my light meter at school with me and my english teacher asked me to show it to the class. The initial reaction was, "why would you be so into measuring light?"


Pff! Indeed, old bean. Tis infuriating.
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#20 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 05:49 PM

Rodrigo Prieto, ASC, AMC (AMC is the Mexican equivalent of the ASC) shot "Amores Perros". He sometimes posts here. Nice guy and insanely talented.

Here's an interview with him:
http://www.kodak.com.../prietoQA.shtml
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