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P2 16gig Cards"Firmware" not for all Panasonic Cameras


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#1 Tom Klein

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Posted 01 June 2007 - 08:01 AM

:angry:
This forum is closest to my dillema, I recently purchased a SPX800 and also ordered the new 16 gig P2 cards to fill up the slots, Well the camera arrived, then shortly after the cards arrived to the dealer. He informed me that these new 16gig cards will not work in the SPX800, the firmware has not been written yet, Panasonic say it may be about next november before they may have the firmware.
I suspect that there maybe other P2 cameras involved in this ****up .
May I sugest that anyone getting into a P2 camera demand written proof from the supplier that the latest cards will work in the camera they have chosen.

I'm now forced into purchasing a bucket load of 8gig cards.

I wonder if come november if the firmware turns up at all?, There will be some very very unhappy pana owners if it dosen't.
Cheers
Tom K
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#2 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 01 June 2007 - 10:13 AM

P2 in "Turns Out To Be a Pain In The Arse" shocker!

Can't say I didn't tell you so...

Phil
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#3 Mitch Gross

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Posted 01 June 2007 - 12:27 PM

Panasonic has posted a schedule for 16g P2 compatibility upgrades. I believe that the HVX200 and the new HPX500 are ready now. The rest are over the summer and early fall. Check with the Panasonic professional website for the breakdown.
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#4 Tom Klein

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Posted 08 July 2007 - 04:43 AM

Panasonic has posted a schedule for 16g P2 compatibility upgrades. I believe that the HVX200 and the new HPX500 are ready now. The rest are over the summer and early fall. Check with the Panasonic professional website for the breakdown.


Spot on Mitch,

it's at https://eww.pavc.pan...sk/e/update.htm

Cheers
Tom Klein
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#5 Tom Klein

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Posted 03 January 2008 - 02:22 AM

:rolleyes:
An Update, now some time has passed, My SPX800E has had two Firmware updates recently and now I use 4x8gig cards and one 32gig card in slot one. this gives me over 2 hours of DVCPro 50 . or over 4hrs DVCpro 25.
Also the camera now talks to my two Mac''s (FCP 6.0.1) and Windows boxes via USB and Firewire, slowly this Format is coming of age.
FWIW, Current Updates are on Panasonics support site and drivers (Mac & Windows) for the Computers and P2 viewer utility for the windows boxes.

https://eww.pavc.pan...esk/e/index.htm

Regarding the file structure on the P2 cards,may I suggest when ingesting into FCP, make sure you set a New "logging bin" for "each" card that you ingest, otherwise all the files become a jumble, and are a nightmare to work with.
Cheers
Tom K
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#6 Tom Klein

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Posted 13 January 2008 - 06:15 PM

Also the camera now talks to my two Mac''s (FCP 6.0.1) and Windows boxes via USB and Firewire, slowly this Format is coming of age.

UPDATE-
Now with my latest Firmware, and a few projest put to bed, here's an example of ingest times.
Log n transfer into FCP 6.0.1 from SPX800E connected USB cable from camera into front USB port of G5 mac,
ingesting SD DVCPro25 , 110 mins of vision and 2ch audio took 38mins to ingest from P2 cards into FCP.
this is a Huge improvement on earlier firmware, keep it coming panasonic, When you can get to ten times that would be Nirvana.
Cheers
Tom K :rolleyes:
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#7 Rory Hanrahan

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 01:47 PM

I'm a huge fan of the P2 workflow, having AC'd 2 features utilizing it, as well as a number of MV's etc. What I keep telling others just getting involved with it though, and as you yourself found out the hard way Tom, is that in order to manage the workflow you have to be on top of what's going on with the tech, what Panasonic is planning, and how your other gear (post setup, etc) all work together. On both of the P2 features I did, there was something -- be it big or small -- that we were unable to do because the tech was catching up with us. On the last one (shot with Abel's Panasonic HPX3000 -- hey Mitch!), initially syncing ourselves up with our post house was a nightmare. We had to dictate exactly how the editing setup was configured, or it was a no-go between production and post (that being said, we did work out our differences in software/gear and getting the footage into their system was a breeze thereafter).

It's amazing (also: funny and scary) what new knowledge and discipline is needed by camera dept. to keep things running the way we expect as we transition into new formats, workflows, etc., but (especially with P2, in my opinion), the ingenuity needed to get a "new" system up and running pays off remarkably in its reliability and ease of use later on.
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#8 Tom Klein

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Posted 15 January 2008 - 06:12 AM

It's amazing (also: funny and scary) what new knowledge and discipline is needed by camera dept. to keep things running the way we expect as we transition into new formats, workflows, etc., but (especially with P2, in my opinion), the ingenuity needed to get a "new" system up and running pays off remarkably in its reliability and ease of use later on.

Your spot on Rory,
In the old days we had "tape", simply took it from VTR to VTR, conected by one or more BNC cables, Dropouts were the enemy.
But, nowdays its "many various Files" of whatever the makers put out, yes a new work flow that takes some transition to get comfortable with.
Never ending problems will be things like changing OS's, software updates, and so on. This will lead to the demise of some file formats we shoot to now ?. just as formats like U-mat and BetaSP bit the techno dust, (I still have both these VTR's in my kit though).
lets hope our Panasonic P2 has the legs for the long haul, or can succesfully integrate into the next best thing that's out there. :rolleyes:
Cheers
Tom K
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#9 Matthew Parnell

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Posted 15 January 2008 - 06:17 PM

All of the P2 software, firmware etc had to be updated because the 16 gig cards work differently to the previous cards. Even the 5 slot P2 usb/firewire interface had to have firmware upgrades.

It is important to note that the new cards must be formated only in camera or using a p2 utility, unlike previous cards, these do not self generate the directory system, so the directories must be generated by the formatting process.

Some of the new management software coming out from Panasonic is pretty good, and with a blu-ray burner in your computer, it finally offers a solid, and soon afordable means of backing up your footage. An area which has always left me cold with P2.

I just cant wait to see 128gig cards!
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#10 banba ban

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 02:17 AM

Some of the new management software coming out from Panasonic is pretty good, and with a blu-ray burner in your computer, it finally offers a solid, and soon afordable means of backing up your footage. An area which has always left me cold with P2.


If you are shooting P2 and archiving to Blu-Ray, why not just shoot Blu-Ray to begin with?
XDCAM/tape allows you to archive your material as it is being shot.
Perhaps P2/drive storage will be as affordable/practical one day, but not at the moment...

Just playing devils advocate, but interested to know why people prefer P2 over other formats.
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#11 Matthew Parnell

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 06:46 AM

P2 is a much easier format to deal with in post production compared to tape. Having worked as an ingest operator handling over 20 hours of footage a day from a variety of formats, from tape to live feeds, once the workflow for P2 is established it is twice as simple and quicker than tape. Not only that, but going P2 means that you don't need to hire or buy an expensive tape deck to work with your footage.


As for XDCAM, the reasons why XDCAM hasn't picked up...

1) Sony haven't delivered a recording format that is good enough. Really the XDCAM HD format is glorified HDV. Their standard def format is pretty average as well. As opposed to Panasonic's DVCPro 50, and DVCPro HD. This goes for the xdcam ex as well.

2) Sony hasn't invested in the cameras to attract users. The cameras arent sensitive enough, they have 1/2inch sensors, limiting lens choices to pro series lenses as opposed to broadcast lenses, they are fairly poorly designed and the list of problems goes on. This goes for the xdcam ex as well.

3) Xdcam is limited to 23gig per Disc. Within 6 months we will be seeing P2 Cards reaching 32gig, within 5 years we will be looking at cards around 128gig and larger at similar prices to todays 16gig cards.

4) The P2 work flow has been developed with better user support and interaction, and therefore has become significantly more user friendly compared to Sony.

Why archive to tape or optical disk? Well its as simple as reliability and cost. Hard Drives and flash memory is in all reality a poor long term storage medium. Since the very begining of P2 it has always been intended to archive to an optical format.
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#12 Rory Hanrahan

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 10:45 AM

I'm excited for Blu-Ray as an archiving medium as well. Once again, I had planned on utilizing it for the last big P2 job I did, but the producers couldn't justify the costs of the burner (even after our 1st AC pointed out that Best Buy etc has good return policies, usually just a re-stocking fee!). Had I a P2 package of my own, a Blu-Ray burner (or Mac w/ said burner) would definitely be part of my kit!

On a more consumer-grade-oriented aside, I've been told that Pana's AVC-HD no longer work's with FCP, but rather (through a Pana-produced piece of software) is now converted to MXF upon import and ingested into FCP as DVC-Pro HD? I'll always embrace low-end formats, and I think its a pretty decent workaround for those of us "slumming it", but does anybody here have any experience with this system?
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#13 monday sunnlinn

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 03:57 PM

:rolleyes:
An Update, now some time has passed, My SPX800E has had two Firmware updates recently and now I use 4x8gig cards and one 32gig card in slot one.




uhh, where'd you get the 32 gig card?
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#14 Mitch Gross

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 05:11 PM

Abel has 32G P2 cards for sale & rent.
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#15 Tom Klein

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Posted 16 January 2008 - 05:49 PM

uhh, where'd you get the 32 gig card?


You can get them anywhere that sells P2 cards, (Try B&H) I'm very pleased with the Five cards I have at the moment, (1x32gig and 4x8gig) my camera has 5 slots, gives me over 2hrs DVCPro50 that staisfies many jobs for me, and to be able to ingest all cards at one via USB into my G5 mac is a hoot.
I mentioned in another post , it took 38mins to ingest 1hr50mins into the mac (FCP 6.0.1).
I will get more 32 gigers as time passes and projects demands and slowly dump the 8 gigers or maybe someone will crack them and put larger cards in side ?? who knows , this format has a long way to go, we are in the early days.
Cheers
Tom K
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