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Sharpest Super 8 Camera and/or Lens.


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#1 Matthew Buick

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Posted 04 September 2007 - 02:50 PM

Just a point of interest here.

What would you say is the sharpest Super 8mm Camera, lens, or camera-lens combination? I've heard the Macro Cinegon 10mm Prime is a pretty sharp lens. I've also heard the Elmo 110R Super is a pretty sharp camera.

Thank you all, let's just have a nice conversation. :)
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#2 Douglas Hunter

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Posted 04 September 2007 - 04:35 PM

Despite its problems I gotta say that my 5008s creates great images. I've used two lenses on it - the stock Ang. 80mm zoom and also a Canon 16 - 102 zoom. Both lenses give very good results. My 814xl-s also seems to have pretty good glass on it. Honestly thought I don't think one can take the discussion of sharpness in Super 8 very far because of the inherent limitation of blowing up such a small image area.
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#3 kevin jackman

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Posted 04 September 2007 - 07:48 PM

i was speaking to a lab person at kodak who had this to say: all things being equal, a 100asa film in super8 will have very similar characteristics to a 400asa film in 16mm from five years ago. im not sure where the latter part of that came from but he confirmed that a professional image was certainly there. the lack of pin registration, a plastic pressure plate and old glass will significantly reduce image quality overall, including sharpness. if you want the best you can get out of the format get a pin registered camera that takes interchangable lenses. use the modern glass you can and/or high quality. the old schneiders arent as goos as you think. if you really want to find out how much glass makes a difference then get various old lenses and rent some modern glass.
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#4 Douglas Hunter

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Posted 04 September 2007 - 11:45 PM

if you want the best you can get out of the format get a pin registered camera that takes interchangable lenses.


You do realize that we are talking about super 8 here don't you? There is no such thing as a pin registered super 8 camera.
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#5 John Adolfi

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 05:18 AM

You do realize that we are talking about super 8 here don't you? There is no such thing as a pin registered super 8 camera.



Perhaps not but the Fujica line of cameras as well as the double super 8 cameras come as close to that ideal as possible. comes
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#6 Glenn Brady

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 08:54 AM

Single 8 and DS8 cameras are undoubtedly capable of getting the most out of the Super 8 format, but the debate about which Super 8 cartridge camera produces the best results seems never to end. Maybe the best way to answer the question is to conduct an objective side-by-side comparison test, using cameras adjusted to their factory specification, loaded with the same emulsion, imaging a test target in controlled temperature/humidity/lighting conditions. Maybe editors at Smallformat and/or Super 8 Today could help put this question to rest.
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#7 Robert Hughes

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 12:40 PM

...which Super 8 cartridge camera produces the best results seems never to end. Maybe the best way to answer the question is to conduct an objective side-by-side comparison test, using cameras adjusted to their factory specification...


This question has been beaten to death over the last several years, and the answer always is: Any camera needs overhaul and regular maintenance in order to provide its best performance. Curiously, almost nobody in the Super 8 world bothers to spend $500 on an overhaul of a camera they bought off eBay for $100. If you are willing to expend the resources necessary to get your Nizo, Braun, Beaulieu, Canon, Nikon, Leica, Bolex, Elmo, Sankyo or whatever camera up to snuff you will get better pictures than 99% of the S8 shooters out there. But if not, it doesn't really matter what brand of 40 year old, broken down piece of crap you have. ya dig?
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#8 Douglas Hunter

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 03:48 PM

Curiously, almost nobody in the Super 8 world bothers to spend $500 on an overhaul of a camera they bought off eBay for $100.


Robert, you'll be glad to know that some of us think that good camera maintainence is a necessity, all the more so when buying on ebay!
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#9 kevin jackman

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 04:10 PM

actually ther eis a pin registered super8 camera. you have to pull a loop out of the cart to load it even...
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#10 Douglas Hunter

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 04:27 PM

actually ther eis a pin registered super8 camera. you have to pull a loop out of the cart to load it even...


Do tell.
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#11 kevin jackman

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 05:11 PM

its called a mekel. it does 10-250 fps. very pin registered. no doubt the steadiest super8 camera out there.
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#12 John Adolfi

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 06:35 PM

its called a mekel. it does 10-250 fps. very pin registered. no doubt the steadiest super8 camera out there.

Sadly its a Polavision camera.
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#13 Douglas Hunter

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 06:46 PM

Sadly its a Polavision camera.


There were two different versions the 300 which was a Polavision camera and the 250 which I believe was not. I forgot about these cameras. There was one on eBay in the past year. Since they are motion analysis cameras they are not well suited for doc. drama, music video etc. But I guess since they have a pin and take C-mount lenses that they would probably win the contest in terms of steady and sharp. Although Stabilizing footage from a 5008s in After Effects, is going to be fine, and obviously can have any of the same glass.
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#14 Dan Salzmann

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Posted 05 September 2007 - 06:46 PM

If I remember correctly Mekel did make a high speed super8 camera. I've only seen photos of it.
Well maintained Canon 1014's and Leicina Specials have given me good results for the format.
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#15 Matthew Buick

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Posted 06 September 2007 - 02:51 PM

Are there any Elmo owners out there who can attest to their quality?
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#16 Robert Hughes

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Posted 06 September 2007 - 03:43 PM

I used to own an Elmo 1012XLS or whatever it was called. It was fine, and had a long zoom. Sound didn't work on it anymore, but who cares?
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#17 kevin jackman

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Posted 06 September 2007 - 04:21 PM

mekel definatly did make this camera. ive seen the manual and there is one for sale floating around. it was for motion analysis but i dont see why this is an issue when doing dramatic or doco work. if anything its really like a miniature arri due to its features. it appears small and easy to use. this is the camera they should be punching out now!
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#18 Mitch Perkins

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Posted 06 September 2007 - 05:07 PM

You do realize that we are talking about super 8 here don't you? There is no such thing as a pin registered super 8 camera.


R10 reg. pin, top left of aperture -

http://home.pacbell....plate_r10r8.jpg

Though sometimes they stick, guaranteeing the most possible jump. ~:?)

Servicing a Super 8 camera involves perhaps more risk than 16mm...?

Best to luck out on a camera that's seen little usage/good storage since it was put together by the carefullest tech on a lucky day during the height of the manufacturer's R&D/quality control. ~:?)

Nikon Superzoom 8 is the sharpest I've seen, including wide open with wide angle attachment. Very cheap.

Mitch
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#19 Dan Salzmann

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Posted 06 September 2007 - 05:15 PM

I don't get the miniature Arri comparison. The already somewhat dodgy registration of super8 will increase by a substantial rate at 250 fps pin or no pin.Also what kind of shot length do you get with a super8 cartridge at that frame rate including the time for the motor to get up to speed?
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#20 Tony Hudson

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Posted 06 September 2007 - 05:38 PM

R10 reg. pin, top left of aperture -

http://home.pacbell....plate_r10r8.jpg

Though sometimes they stick, guaranteeing the most possible jump. ~:?)

Servicing a Super 8 camera involves perhaps more risk than 16mm...?

Best to luck out on a camera that's seen little usage/good storage since it was put together by the carefullest tech on a lucky day during the height of the manufacturer's R&D/quality control. ~:?)

Nikon Superzoom 8 is the sharpest I've seen, including wide open with wide angle attachment. Very cheap.

Mitch



The 2nd claw on a Nikon R10 is not a reg pin.
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