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Nizo 6080


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#1 Tennent McCabe

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Posted 27 November 2007 - 09:59 PM

What type of film would anyone recommend for the Nizo 6080
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#2 Michael Lehnert

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Posted 27 November 2007 - 10:38 PM

Welcome to cinematography.com!

What type of film would anyone recommend for the Nizo 6080


Because of the Multi-Pin system the Nizo sound cameras use, you can use any Super 8 film available on the market and get the correct exposure index setting, provided that the cartridge is actually correctly notched by the seller.

So the camera will not cause any trouble. The question should hence rather be: Do I want to shoot colour or B&W? In reversal or in negative? If you anwered those questions for yourself much closer to aesthetical issues rather than technical ones (money and resulting prod chain aside), feel free to come back so that we can evaluate what film stock to choose and if the sold cartridges are correclty notched and hence work correctly in the SMPTE-compliant Nizo 6080.

Enjoy.
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#3 Tennent McCabe

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Posted 27 November 2007 - 11:10 PM

Hows this, would you shoot a campy feature length horror film in s8mm or s16mm?
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#4 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 08:09 AM

Hows this, would you shoot a campy feature length horror film in s8mm or s16mm?


It probably depends on how big your camera crew is going to be, and how you are recording sound and doing lighting.

I've been the only one in the camera department on a shorter super-8 project, but we were not recording audio. Recording live audio can add a layer of complexity to the shoot that might also require additional help in the camera department for labeling the films and such, at which point your daily crew budget might rise enough to go to Super-16.

When in doubt, shoot a practice scene in whichever format you think you want to shoot your feature in and see if you like the entire process.
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#5 Tennent McCabe

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 08:32 AM

The crew is two other people and myself. The film has a VERY small budget. Thats why I was thinking about shooting in Super 8. What kind of sound equipment should be used if we were to shoot it in Super 8?
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#6 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 08:00 PM

For recording audio I like the idea of a small, super compact, quiet video camera with (2) professional XLR inputs and manual or automatic settings that actually mean what they say and say what they mean. lol, I don't think they make such a device. (I mean smaller than a Canon XLS). It makes it so much easier to sync audio when you have a video picture reference.

Maybe digital still cameras will be made that are actually more of an audio recording device but with still picture capability so one can grab a picture of the slate.
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#7 Jess Haas

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 01:19 AM

The Nizo 6080 is a great little camera for shooting sound because as far as super8 goes it is damn quiet. That said you will still want some sort of barney and maybe a few furny pads to quiet it even more. You may want to seriously consider getting it moded for crystal sync. These guys can hook you up for $500 if they are still doing it: http://users.aol.com/fmgp/sync8.htm

If I were you I would have a sound guy who had a minimum of a boom with a shotgun mic and a portable DAT or harddisk recorder. Even if the crew really only ends up being you and two other people you should make one of them the sound guy.

Add a slate and you have a sync sound movie.

~Jess
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#8 Bernhard Zitz

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 05:55 AM

I have a 6080. Allthough it is NOT crystal sync it has very little shift at 25fps (yes I live in a PAL-country). If you keep the takes short and don't mind a little edting of the audio, you should be fine for sound without the crystal conversion. A good idea is to clap at the start and on the end of the take, this shows you the amount of shift.

As allways; tests will tell you more.

cheers, Bernhard
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#9 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 04:23 PM

I have a 6080. Allthough it is NOT crystal sync it has very little shift at 25fps (yes I live in a PAL-country). If you keep the takes short and don't mind a little edting of the audio, you should be fine for sound without the crystal conversion. A good idea is to clap at the start and on the end of the take, this shows you the amount of shift.

As allways; tests will tell you more.

cheers, Bernhard



A couple of years back I synced dailys for a 16mm film project after the film had been transferred to betacam sp. The camera used was a non crystal Canon Scoopic. It can be time consuming work to sync dailies especially if the camera is not crystal synced, but it wasn't that difficult to do. I figured out a syncing technique that doubles the time the shot stays in sync. First I figure out which way the picture is drifting in relation to the sound. Rather than sync the clapper exactly at the moment of impact with the board, I cheat it about two to three frames in the opposite direction of the actual drift.

By the time the slate is out of the shot and the scene officially begins the sound is actually getting closer to perfect sync. In essence what this does is double or triple the amount of time before the shot goes noticeably out of sync. But you have to be a real stickler for what is noticeably out of sync. Which is why you MUST have absolutely full frame real time no delay sound syncing if you do the syncing in your computer.

Generally, one can be 2 video frames off in either direction, so that actually equals a four frame drift. Sync so that that the shot drifts perfectly into sync and then drifts off, rather than nailing the slate and then having it go out of sync twice as fast.
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#10 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 04:28 PM

One more thing. If the 16mm or 35mm camera uses belts to drive the film, make sure they are not worn or stretched as that can create an additional wow and flutter to the running speed of the camera.
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#11 Jess Haas

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 05:05 PM

If you are seriously making a feature length project spending $500 to simply shoot it crystal synced will save you enough time in post to more than justify the expense. I have had very good success with non sync cameras by slating at the beginning and end of every shot and then stretching the audio to match. This takes extra time in post and also extra film so for a feature length project would not be worthwhile if crystal sync is a viable option.

~Jess
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#12 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 09:29 PM

If you are seriously making a feature length project spending $500 to simply shoot it crystal synced will save you enough time in post to more than justify the expense. I have had very good success with non sync cameras by slating at the beginning and end of every shot and then stretching the audio to match. This takes extra time in post and also extra film so for a feature length project would not be worthwhile if crystal sync is a viable option.

~Jess


An argument can be made that by not having to tail slate the filmmaker should save a significant amount of money in less film shot, processed and transferred, and syncing should then go faster as well, so it does appear that money would be saved during the shoot.

However, is the process of adding the sync module 100% safe, or is this some form of "surgery" being performed on the super-8 camera with some level of risk involved? Will the camera be as ergonomically designed as before the "operation", or will there be a module added that sometimes gets in they way? I'm just asking, I'm not insinuating.

Also, since the camera is going to be opened anyway, couldn't some kind of general servicing be done at the same time?
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#13 Michael Lehnert

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 09:43 PM

Yes, I would also actually like to hear more about the crystal-sync'ing, how it's done, how it changes the visual appearence of the body etc. Nizo crystal-sync'ing is unusual in Europe (mostly Beaulieus get quartzed here).
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#14 Jess Haas

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 10:10 PM

The link I posted before should answer most of your questions.

They do open the camera and add a small jack to it. This is rather simple surgery so I wouldn't be too worried. This only adds something comparable to a small headphone jack to the camera. When the module is removed the camera will still have the same ergonomics it originally had.

While Beaulieu's are the most common camera converted the Nizo 6080 is a much quieter camera so it actually makes a much better sync sound camera.

~Jess
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#15 Michael Lehnert

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 10:29 PM

Point taken.
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#16 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 11:47 PM

The Nizo 6080 is a great little camera for shooting sound because as far as super8 goes it is damn quiet. That said you will still want some sort of barney and maybe a few furny pads to quiet it even more. You may want to seriously consider getting it moded for crystal sync. These guys can hook you up for $500 if they are still doing it: http://users.aol.com/fmgp/sync8.htm

If I were you I would have a sound guy who had a minimum of a boom with a shotgun mic and a portable DAT or harddisk recorder. Even if the crew really only ends up being you and two other people you should make one of them the sound guy.

Add a slate and you have a sync sound movie.

~Jess


They give a lot of excellent pre-advice on how to spot a "spotty" camera. Tis a shame they don't have their own technician that could actually do the servicing that may need to be done.
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Glidecam

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Ritter Battery

Visual Products

Willys Widgets

Metropolis Post

The Slider

Abel Cine

FJS International, LLC

Rig Wheels Passport

Wooden Camera

Tai Audio

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