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#1 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 11:09 AM

I checked Tim's registration page and this is the FIRST thing you see:

Forum Terms & Rules

READ THIS - IT'S NOT LONG :)


You must register using your REAL NAME. That means your first name, a space, then your last name. If you don't use your real name, or you register with a name that looks like your real name but we find out is not your real name, your account will be permanently disabled.


So why do so many new people seem to skip the first instruction listed???
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#2 Richard Boddington

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 11:17 AM

Maybe because it's such a bizarre rule?

99% of the web forums out there allow people to use handles, shadowpuppet99, jetboy5000, lioncub121, etc etc.

Using your real name is quite unique and I'm sure some people think it's a security risk.

Look at me my real name is Alfonzo Cabrini, but I use Richard Boddington.

R,
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#3 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 11:37 AM

Look at me my real name is Alfonzo Cabrini, but I use Richard Boddington.


That explains why you look so Mediterranean!
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#4 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 11:52 AM

So why do so many new people seem to skip the first instruction listed???

Unfortunately, I think for the most part it's a mixture of people just not caring what the rules are, and people just not being very smart.
I try to be an optimist, but I just can't find any other explanation.
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#5 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 11:55 AM

Unfortunately, I think for the most part it's a mixture of people just not caring what the rules are, and people just not being very smart.
I try to be an optomist, but I just can't find any other explanation.


For a small percentage, I think one factor is that some of the Middle Eastern and Indian names are quite long, so they are hesitant about using them as a User Name. Maybe some sort of shortened version would be OK in those cases.
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#6 Mitch Gross

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 11:57 AM

I think most people just don't read the instructions.
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#7 Lance Flores

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 12:17 PM

I checked Tim's registration page and this is the FIRST thing you see:

So why do so many new people seem to skip the first instruction listed???


"READ THIS - IT'S NOT LONG"

Perhaps the title is too long for most.
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#8 Alexander Disenhof

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 12:17 PM

As a relatively new member to this forum, I can say that I thought that having to use my full name was a little odd, and my mind briefly thought of security, since in today's world you really can't be too careful. But, I am also new to the whole forum thing in general, so I didn't think much more of it and I just followed the rules. I don't think that stupidity has much to do with it - most active members here seem pretty smart to me. I could see people just ignoring the rules too though...
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#9 Hal Smith

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 12:28 PM

You think things are tight here? Try violating one of Geoff or the listmum's policies over on cml.

"You have no papers? I'm so sorry, we have to shoot you."
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#10 Lance Flores

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 12:29 PM

For a small percentage, I think one factor is that some of the Middle Eastern and Indian names are quite long, so they are hesitant about using them as a User Name. Maybe some sort of shortened version would be OK in those cases.


When I was in semiconductor R&D, one of the physicists in my group who was Indian, had a long first name and a very long last name. We talked about his office name plate which done in two panels in order present his full name. He said he had the operations department make them that way because it frightened the sales guys, and they wouldn't come into his office and ask stupid questions.
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#11 Richard Boddington

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 01:09 PM

"they wouldn't come into his office and ask stupid questions."

So that's how we stop stupid questions being asked here!!!

R,
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#12 Mark Williams

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 02:11 PM

Many problems with the use of real names. First of course is security and personal information. And really its absolutely daft on this basis alone to use a real name.

Another reason is this is a forum where we are all equal and in that equality we can say and do within reason what is in our own opinion right and fair. Without fear of upsetting someone higher in the entertainment world whose opinions would normally be regarded as THE only opinion rightly or wrongly that matters. For some giving a real name is advantageous especially if they are famous as many will seek to gain favour or just plain accept the argument from that person. Thats fine and can bring prestige and more professionals. However for those lower down in the pecking order who have a different opinion it can mean being ostracised. Often in many forums just to try to glean a little information can be an uphill battle in overcoming personalities. There are some that sometimes want to prove allegiance to a group or to settle an old score. Thats fine. A little banter and even developing a thick skin can be good. However sometimes a sore loser can and will make sure certain people will not find work where they have a say. Sometimes potential careers can be ruined through mischievous silly petty arguments.

SO when were working and being paid the boss is always right. When we are making films our peers know best because we are being paid to do a job that even if we dont agree we must act professional and follow the vision we are paid to follow.

BUT on a forum we're all equal and shouldnt have to pay a penalty professionally.

On a forum were all equal... In real life were not. Use your real name at your own risk.
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#13 Richard Boddington

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 02:26 PM

So you are not really Mark Collins?

R,
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#14 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 02:30 PM

Having participated in MANY filmmaking forums over the years, I prefer the ones that require the use of real names. Sites that allow nicknames and pseudonyms often get bogged down and sidetracked by overly obnoxious anonymous posters who feel free to throw hand grenades into every discussion because there are no personal repercussions.

It's not a problem with all people, but there is a percentage in society who feel freed from the bounds of ordinary manners, polite conversion, professionalism, whatever, by writing under a pseudonym. If that led to a higher quality of posts, I'd be all for it, but unfortunately it encourages trolls, pranksters, troublemakers, more often than not, and when they've totally made everyone hate them and driven the quality of discourse to alltime lows, they quit (or are banned) only to resurface a month later under a new pseudonym.

As for the notion of it being dangerous to post under one's real name, many us of have managed to make thousands and thousands of posts for over a decade on the internet without any negative repercussions, so I'm still waiting for this shoe to drop. It seems some people want to live their lives in constant fear of strangers.

My general feeling is that you should be willing to sign your name to your own opinions, unless you are a whistleblower or critic of a dangerous government, etc. But we're talking about CINEMATOGRAPHY here.

This site has improved greatly over the years thanks to the gradual insistence on using real names here. If there were no problems in the past with anonymous posters, then this rule would have never needed to be implemented, would it? You can thank those troublemakers for the current rules -- they didn't spring out of thin air, with no precedent. They are a RESULT of dealing with anonymous posters. We could go back to the days of allowing people to use pseudonyms and I can almost guarantee that within two years people will be talking about going back to a real names rule.

When I started out on this site in 1996 (?) I think, I was a nobody and people still responded to the quality of my posts -- it wasn't a matter of having a lot of credits or "ASC" after my name (that didn't happen until 2005), it was an issue of recognizing that I was speaking with some knowledge. You learn quickly who seems to know what they are talking about, regardless of their credits. Kevin Zanit, for example, has always had knowledgeable posts that people respected even though he was only 20 when he started here.

But the issue is that some people just have to ruin it for others by abusing the right to post anonymously and ultimately sites like this one, or the CML, or DVInfo.net, decide it's not worth the hassle regardless of any merits it may have. CML even created a separate anonymous forum and people abused it to the point where Geoff Boyle killed it.
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#15 Satsuki Murashige

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 02:44 PM

I think we should point out another benefit of using our real names on the forum - it fosters a stronger sense of community here which you won't find in most other forums. I've managed to work with a number of different forum members based in my area already, and hope I get to meet more members in person in the future. The professional film community is not a big one, and getting your name out there will help you get work and make contacts (provided that you present yourself as someone other people would actually want to be around :) ).

Edited by Satsuki Murashige, 06 December 2007 - 02:48 PM.

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#16 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:17 PM

Hey, I got to have a nice lunch with "Richard Boddington" because of this forum... though suspiciously, he does speak with an outrageous Italian accent and looks like one of the models used to create the Super Mario Brothers video game. He said he was a Mormon from Canada who doesn't believe in the death penalty, but I didn't buy it for one minute, Alfonzo.
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#17 Tom Lowe

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:26 PM

I think most people just don't read the instructions.


This pretty much sums it up.
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#18 Stephen Williams

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:34 PM

Hey, I got to have a nice lunch with "Richard Boddington" because of this forum... though suspiciously, he does speak with an outrageous Italian accent and looks like one of the models used to create the Super Mario Brothers video game. He said he was a Mormon from Canada who doesn't believe in the death penalty, but I didn't buy it for one minute, Alfonzo.


Hi David,

Richard is in good company! http://www.famousmor....net/bus02.html

Stephen
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#19 Michael Lehnert

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:48 PM

Actually, the use of real names compelled me to register here two months ago and become active in the first place ? and no, it's not an unconscious ego thing :) .

I consider this to be a forum for professionals. By that, I don't necessarily mean just people who are reputable members of the ASC, or are DoP'ing for major studios or broadcasters and spend their skiing holiday with Jack Nicholson in Aspen, but people who have a professional attitude towards cinematography and want to learn from others and can also provide others with knowledge should they require it, on a civil communicative (human) basis.

They can be film students, hobbyist, freelancers, studio employees, one-off helping hands, volontaires, private individuals or folks with major credits and one box office blockbuster every other year... what matters is that they take their activity here serious (though not too earnest - being able to laugh about what goes on in the industry matters as well ;) ).

And a sign of seriousness is actually to have the guts and not "hide" behind anonymity or frankly idiotic pseudonyms like "Vision3smasher2007" or "REDfan1080" or "Super8-booster" or "RegisterPin1to1-85" or "Richard Boddington", but stand up for what one posts with one's name attached to it, and hence her/his reputation, honour, and also the association with one's filmwork, whether its shown in cinemas (movie theatres, if you want) or own-distributed DVD/BluRays or just on YouTube.

And I think all this, represented in the full first/last name policy, is what makes this place a more civilisedly conducted forum than some others I have previously read but not registered.

As far as people not getting it upon registration are concerned: well, I think some are just overreading it (one cannot imagine what megasized alerts people overread today, it's horrible ? so much for professional attitude, by the way), some might just think they are cleverer than others and just don't do it (although the identity theft fear in relation to the content posted here escapes me a bit ? and if people fear repression from bosses, then they can still think upo a name, lile "Richard Boddington", for example), and some are ? frankly ? just dumb as bread (and post accordingly).

There aren't any mdoerators in the Super 8 forum, but if someone posts there with the name "BillyBoyShooter", then either Alessandro Machi or myself made in an implicit attitude to remind them of the policy ? not one has not apologised and immediately changed his user names accordingly!

-Michael Lehnert (a.k.a. Clarke Zooming)
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#20 Daniel Sheehy

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:50 PM

Another reason is this is a forum where we are all equal and in that equality we can say and do within reason what is in our own opinion right and fair. Without fear of upsetting someone higher in the entertainment world whose opinions would normally be regarded as THE only opinion rightly or wrongly that matters. For some giving a real name is advantageous especially if they are famous as many will seek to gain favour or just plain accept the argument from that person. Thats fine and can bring prestige and more professionals. However for those lower down in the pecking order who have a different opinion it can mean being ostracised. Often in many forums just to try to glean a little information can be an uphill battle in overcoming personalities. There are some that sometimes want to prove allegiance to a group or to settle an old score. Thats fine. A little banter and even developing a thick skin can be good. However sometimes a sore loser can and will make sure certain people will not find work where they have a say. Sometimes potential careers can be ruined through mischievous silly petty arguments.

I've heard that argument a lot, but I have never seen it happen.

Petty, vindictive behaviour is usually pretty obvious to everyone else... and I've never seen it tolerated.
On the contrary, people, even on forums that don't require real names, seem to trust each other more when they know the real identity behind the mask. Lasting friendships & job opportunities sometimes result...
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