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ripping for reels


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#1 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 04:17 PM

So I've been updating my reel of late and I've had some issues with getting decent video to use from a ripped DVD. I'm a bit of an idiot when it comes to compression and things of that nature, and I could use some help.
I've been cutting in Final Cut on my friends mac. I have no problem getting the video ripped from the DVD using Handbrake, but I'm having problems with image steadiness in that video. It looks as if there is a vibration on all the stuff I've ripped, and the more camera movement there is (it's a steadicam reel so there is a lot) the worse this vibration gets. And it's at the point where a running shot and a couple of other shots I'd like to use are totally unusable. Also, the video is a bit pixelated and doesn't respond very well when I'm trying to cut in FCP.
Any suggestions? What is the best compression format to rip with? What else should I be paying attention to that I'm not? Like I said, I'm pretty ignorant in this area, so basic info to start would be great. I'm finally really liking my reel, but the damn thing is hard to watch at certain points!
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#2 John Brawley

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 04:30 PM

So I've been updating my reel of late and I've had some issues with getting decent video to use from a ripped DVD. I'm a bit of an idiot when it comes to compression and things of that nature, and I could use some help.
I've been cutting in Final Cut on my friends mac. I have no problem getting the video ripped from the DVD using Handbrake, but I'm having problems with image steadiness in that video. It looks as if there is a vibration on all the stuff I've ripped, and the more camera movement there is (it's a steadicam reel so there is a lot) the worse this vibration gets. And it's at the point where a running shot and a couple of other shots I'd like to use are totally unusable. Also, the video is a bit pixelated and doesn't respond very well when I'm trying to cut in FCP.
Any suggestions? What is the best compression format to rip with? What else should I be paying attention to that I'm not? Like I said, I'm pretty ignorant in this area, so basic info to start would be great. I'm finally really liking my reel, but the damn thing is hard to watch at certain points!



Sounds to me like perhaps the field order is getting screwed up ? I think in the advanced settings, under video, there is a drop down menu that lets you de-interlace the video. Try this and see if it helps.

Otherwise i usually slide the the data rate up towards 2000kps using H264.

Mate, DVD's are a distribution format, not an editorial format. It's always going to be a struggle to come back from them. It's the digital equivalent of cutting with VHS material. I'd try to get better copies of the show's you've been working on, at least DV.

Good luck !

jb
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#3 Rolfe Klement

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 05:00 PM

I did the same thing cause the Production company took ages to do anything once the show is complete.

I used Handbrake
Created a full resolution VOB file
Brought the VOB file into FCP (not viewable in timeline until render)
Exported with FCP Compressor using Quicktime H264 at high res

http://www.creatives...sp?projectID=30

If you do not have FCP then maybe QT pro can convert VOB to H264...

hope this helps

thanks

Rolfe
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#4 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 05:12 PM

I am not 100% sure of this, so anyone that knows better please say so (Phil Rhodes...) You can copy the .VOB file direct from the disc to your hard drive, then change the file extension to .m2v. This will allow quicktime & final cut to recognise it as an mpeg2 & play it (although FCP will still need to render it). Then I think the best thing is to export it as DV, and then re import it into FCP where you can now edit it natively. It's far from ideal, but it should work.
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#5 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 05:36 PM

Mate, DVD's are a distribution format, not an editorial format. It's always going to be a struggle to come back from them. It's the digital equivalent of cutting with VHS material. I'd try to get better copies of the show's you've been working on, at least DV.

Good luck !

jb

Of course I would prefer not to have to do it this way, but it's very hard to get footage from studios and networks. It's especially hard when you do one or two episodes of a show and want the footage. It's easier when you're on the show full time and have access to dailies.
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#6 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 05:42 PM

I used Handbrake
Created a full resolution VOB file
Brought the VOB file into FCP (not viewable in timeline until render)
Exported with FCP Compressor using Quicktime H264 at high res

thanks

Rolfe

That sounds exactly like what I did. I was definitely creating VOB files. The thing is there are dozens of choices as to compression and format and I don't have a clue as to what works best. I was guessing that I just used the wrong settings....any thoughts on that? I'm sure I could play with it and keep trying, but it could take days or weeks to figure out what works best since these issues didn't really show up until I burned a disk and played it in a DVD player. And if I remember correctly there are settings for Handbrake and also settings for FCP. Lots of different combinations...I'd love to narrow it down as opposed to burning tons of bad DVD's.
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#7 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 05:45 PM

You can copy the .VOB file direct from the disc to your hard drive, then change the file extension to .m2v. This will allow quicktime & final cut to recognise it as an mpeg2 & play it (although FCP will still need to render it). Then I think the best thing is to export it as DV, and then re import it into FCP where you can now edit it natively. It's far from ideal, but it should work.

So would I export the file as DV to the hard drive or to a tape?

Thanks for the info and tips so far everybody.
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#8 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 07:23 PM

Export it as DV from QT or FCP to a hard drive, then import it into FCP and edit from there. This should work, but I have no idea what kind of quality hit you'll take.

Best of luck.
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#9 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 08:45 PM

Thanks Stuart. I'm currently laughing at myself because I feel like a child trying to learn the simplest task, like tying my shoes, for the first time.
The last time I cut anything for money it was tape to tape with two beta decks!
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#10 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 08:48 PM

What sort of files can iMovie handle? I've been cutting my reel from DV tapes, but now I'm going to have to get the footage off of DVD's.
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#11 Adrian Sierkowski

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 09:06 PM

IM pretty sure iMovie can't handle the .vob files or m2v. You'll have to get it into an older version of an MPEG overall.
If you have a little miniDV camera at home, try running your DVD player into it, putting the camera into VCR mode, and then play and record!
Then just connect via firewire, and capture from there.
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#12 Jason Outenreath

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Posted 11 December 2007 - 09:32 PM

The easiest way, and the way I've done it, is just by opening the DVD (on the desktop), and finding the largest VOB file in the video folder, and then dragging it directly into FCP. If don't need sound and just want the images.
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#13 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 12 December 2007 - 12:36 AM

If you have a little miniDV camera at home, try running your DVD player into it, putting the camera into VCR mode, and then play and record!
Then just connect via firewire, and capture from there.

That won't work will it? Don't you need a TimeBase corrector or some such thing? I think DVD's are encoded purposely so that you can't do exactly what you're saying you can. But again, I'm pretty clueless on this issue. It just sounds too simple.
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#14 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 12 December 2007 - 12:38 AM

The easiest way, and the way I've done it, is just by opening the DVD (on the desktop), and finding the largest VOB file in the video folder, and then dragging it directly into FCP. If don't need sound and just want the images.

Again, this sounds so simple it's hard to believe it will work, but I'll certainly give it a try. I'm not using any production sound for my reel so this solution would be perfect.
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#15 Adrian Sierkowski

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Posted 12 December 2007 - 12:42 AM

That won't work will it? Don't you need a TimeBase corrector or some such thing? I think DVD's are encoded purposely so that you can't do exactly what you're saying you can. But again, I'm pretty clueless on this issue. It just sounds too simple.


Normally works.
I recall having had one DVD give me a strange "pulsation," but that's normally due to a VCR in the chain to my TV (VHS). The DVD, from what I can see, or moreover the player, just reads the camera as another TV. Now; this may not work with all cameras or DVD players, but for myself it hasn't been an issue (as of yet aside from that one time)

Give it a try, i mean, you've only got to loose say, 5 minutes of life.
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#16 Bruce Greene

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Posted 12 December 2007 - 01:09 AM

Oh for the days of the laser disc!

I've faced this also and ripped some clips from the dvd when I had no other choice. After decompression and rendering again in FCP for output to dvd and the web I've found that the ripped dvd clips don't hold up well at all.

On some other clips, I've copied dvd dailies on the set via s-video cable to my mini dv recorder. These have looked quite good.

The problem with commerical dvds is the Macrovision copy protection when trying to make an analog copy. My mini dv deck won't record at all from these discs.

I think that a true professional dv deck will have no problem with the Macrovision...but I have a question: Has anyone tried one of those "video enhancer" boxes that are claimed to defeat the Macrovision? If they really work, it might be the best and most practical way of getting clips for our sample reels from commercial dvds.

-bruce
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#17 Will Earl

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Posted 13 December 2007 - 03:53 PM

Sorry Brad, I don't have a mac - so this piece of advice isn't going to be that helpful to you seen as it only really applies to Windows users.

I've been using Video Cleaner Pro for the sole purpose of converting DVD to DV, not that great a program (it bugs out sometimes and refuses to export anything), but it manages to convert DVD to DV. You'll still need a program along the lines of DVD Decrypter to rip the files to the HDD.

http://www.riverpast...d/videocleaner/

-Will
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#18 Tom Lowe

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Posted 13 December 2007 - 04:41 PM

On a PC there are any number of programs like TMPEG that than convert a VOB file to an uncompressed AVI. Then you drop the AVI into your NLE's timeline, and off you go.
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