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Fuji Velvia jitter


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#1 Marty Hamrick

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 10:00 PM

I just shot a roll of Fuji Velvia from Spectra in my Canon 814.The colors came out stunning and the footage looks great except the jitter is unacceptable.When I first got it back from Spectra,I ran it on a projector and I thought the jitter could be the fault of the projector.I was pretty certain it wasn't the camera as I had just shot a roll of Vision 200T and had it processed at the same place and transferred by our good friend on this forum,Mr.David Leugers.The Vision 200T was stable as a table.David did an excellent job on both rolls,yet after getting the transfer of the Velvia,it's apparent the jitter is in the cartridge.

I have two questions.There used to be a service for the bigger formats(been ages since I've dealt with this,early mid 90's)some labs called "electronic stableization",where the jitter could be taken out in the telecine.Anyone have any experience with this and can it be done for super 8?

What's the problem with Velvia in a super 8 cart?I really love the stock,but don't plan on shooting anymore if this problem keeps up.I plan on reshooting some of the shots for my project on 100 D .Any bad registration reports on that stock?
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#2 James Compton

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 11:18 PM

35,16,Super 8. Yep, it can be done. Apple Motion 3. The SmoothCam feature allows you to remove jitter.
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#3 Michael Lehnert

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 07:41 PM

Such jitter problems are found in V-50 carts sold by GK-Film under the Cinevia label. This is due to... manufacturing difficulties of some grander scale (I use careful wording to avoid attracting the anger of the German Velvia fanboy scene here).

V-50 as sold by Wittner Cinetec and Spectra should have been specially prepared using a coating that smoothes-out potential transportation issues due to the film emulsion not really "fitting well" into the cart unprep'd. So far, I heard nothing but good about their products. It might be that your cart had not received such pre-prep, or that it was incorrectly or insufficiently put on, or that you suffered one of those possible one-off problems with a third-party-supplied film stock in a Super 8 cartridge.

I would raise the issue with Spectra ASAP to get them on track to deal with the batch that cart of yours originates from, just so that a potential wider issue can be dealt with straight away.

I hope you will be able to de-jitter the shots with Cupertino's Motion. Keep us posted on that, please!

Cheers, -Michael
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#4 Mike Crane

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 11:13 PM

I shot some Spectra Velvia in my canon 814 Autozoom with perfect transport and registration. I wonder if it might be a rogue cart that had a problem. That seems to happen even with kodak loaded cartridges.

You might also try the Velvia in another camera. Some cameras work better with certian films than others.
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#5 Victor Mejia

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Posted 26 February 2008 - 09:48 PM

I just shot a roll of Fuji Velvia from Spectra in my Canon 814.The colors came out stunning and the footage looks great except the jitter is unacceptable.When I first got it back from Spectra,I ran it on a projector and I thought the jitter could be the fault of the projector.I was pretty certain it wasn't the camera as I had just shot a roll of Vision 200T and had it processed at the same place and transferred by our good friend on this forum,Mr.David Leugers.The Vision 200T was stable as a table.David did an excellent job on both rolls,yet after getting the transfer of the Velvia,it's apparent the jitter is in the cartridge.

I have two questions.There used to be a service for the bigger formats(been ages since I've dealt with this,early mid 90's)some labs called "electronic stableization",where the jitter could be taken out in the telecine.Anyone have any experience with this and can it be done for super 8?

What's the problem with Velvia in a super 8 cart?I really love the stock,but don't plan on shooting anymore if this problem keeps up.I plan on reshooting some of the shots for my project on 100 D .Any bad registration reports on that stock?


I stopped shooting Velvia Super 8 because of problems with jitter AND scratching. It seems to be an overly sensitive stock?not very robust in the small format although the images are superfreaking gorgeous. I've shot all of Kodak's stock in super 8 and have NEVER had a problem with scratches or jitter. Velvia on the other hand... The problem is in the cart and the way the film is loaded?at least that's my suspicion.
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#6 Marty Hamrick

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Posted 28 February 2008 - 09:25 AM

I would raise the issue with Spectra ASAP to get them on track to deal with the batch that cart of yours originates from, just so that a potential wider issue can be dealt with straight away.


Cheers, -Michael


I did raise the issue with Spectra,this is their response.

Hi Marty,

Sorry to hear about your film transport problems.

We do not have a method to remove stability issues electronically. However, editing software often has the ability to do this.

Did you buy the film over a year ago? We have applied cartridge treatments to improve reliability about a year ago.

In most cameras the Velvia preforms quite well. However, due to differences in film thickness and camera gates all super 8 films can never have a 100% guarantee to work perfectly all the time. At times I have heard from our customers that TriX or 64T films have transport problems while the Velvia works perfectly. It all depends on the camera, the film, and adjustments inside the camera. Gate adjustments and take-up tension are critical.

That being said, most cameras will usually run all films without an issue. I should also mention that many of our customers own Canon 814AZ camera and have never reported a problem with our current Velvia.

The Velvia usually has stunning results. It may be worth trying it out one more time to see if it was a one-time cartridge issue.

Please contact us should you have any additional questions we can help you with.
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#7 Mike Crane

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 03:26 AM

Those bastards! I think we should blow Spectra up for not delivering Velvia perfection!

Seriously, I get jitter and scratches from Kodak loaded carts too. Super 8 has never been perfect. It's part of the deal in this format. I had a 518SV camera that ran Kodak negative and Velvia perfectly, but, Kodak black and white film nearly always had a bad jitter. That didn't stop me from shooting TriX. I like it too much! So, after some experimentation, I found that it worked better in some of my other cameras.

Marty, I think it is good of you to let them know whats up. I am sure Spectra is working on improvements to get Velvia to work every time in every camera. They always seem to be working hard (and late) to make their customers happy. Meanwhile, I still plan to shoot their sweet looking Velvia without protest. I have never found a better looking color film and appreciate their extreme efforts to make it available.

As an alternative, there are other companies in Europe that sell Velvia. Perhaps you might want to give them a try.
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#8 andy oliver

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 02:00 PM

I'm afraid to say, the wittner 16mm 50d ( latest batch ) also produces an un-stable image. Results back from the lab today were stunningly sharp, but just not stable. The 100d however exposed at the same time was rock solid, but nowhere as sharp. Oh well, back to 16mm k40.

Edited by andy oliver, 29 February 2008 - 02:02 PM.

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#9 Jean Beaudoin

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 03:33 PM

Where can we find Fuji Velvia Super 8 cartridges in North America ? In Canada ?
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#10 Michael Lehnert

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 05:35 PM

As an alternative, there are other companies in Europe that sell Velvia. Perhaps you might want to give them a try.


- Wittner Cinetec (Beaulieu DE) sold it in S8 cart, now only on core for the Beaulieu SD8/60 magazine. Odd payment practices, slow communication and long-ish delivery team, but only salespoint for many products.

- GK-Film, The Inventor of Cinevia ® (to jokingly paraphrase JVC's former slogan as "The Inventor of VHS"... ah well...) will be selling V-50 again using his own cartridge design (so far more vapourware than design breakthrough) via Unsaleable, a company highly regarded for its efforts in the Polaroid world.

Where can we find Fuji Velvia Super 8 cartridges in North America ? In Canada ?


Spectra Film & Video, the only place to consistently sell V-50 and E-100, currently freshly available.

Pro8mm also sells these stock, but it is generally giving out the advice themselves not to shop with them or indeed enter in business relations of any kind because of their merchant behaviour.
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#11 Alessandro Machi

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 09:57 PM

Pro8mm also sells these stock, but it is generally giving out the advice themselves not to shop with them or indeed enter in business relations of any kind because of their merchant behaviour.


lol. Sounds an awful lot like "Arnold's Rug". Arnold's rug was a yellow pages commercial that featured a storeowner who refused to sell or rent his only rug, because then he would have none.
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