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How do 7229 and 7205 cut together?


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#1 Peter Olney

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 02:33 PM

Hi,
I am working on a student short film and its my first time using 16mm colour stock. The story is based on a visually impaired girls experience at school. It consists of two scenes, one in a bathroom and the other in class. Our director wants to convey two completely different moods within each area. Initially i hoped to achieve this by using 2 different stocks.

To convey a more dramatic look in the bathroom, I had planned to shoot on the vision2 250d 7205 and use a single source HMI to back light through a window, bouncing the light back with foam core boards.

The classroom needs to be subtle and muted so i originally planned using the vision2 expression 500t 7229 in conjunction with a wratten 85 filter. I based a lighting plan around diffusing tungsten lights combined with either kino flos or chinaballs corrected with full CTB to allow for ambient daylight.

Now comes my problem! Though I want to create different moods, my concern is how both stocks will cut together. Ideally I would like the flesh tones and colour palettes to match. Has anyone got any experience/examples of how these two stock cut together? Would I be better off using the 500t 7229, NDing down and flagging off areas to craft the light?

I have already suggested an alternative 500t stock that may cut better with the 250d but my director has his heart set on the expression.

Any help and advise would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!!! :)
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#2 Laurent Andrieux

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 04:20 PM

It may not be a bad choice, but the 18 and more likely the 17 are supposed to match better the daylight stock, because the 29 has a particularly low contrast. If you want to stick to 500 T, why not give the new vision3 7219 a try ?

Why not work with daylight stock in the classroom ? For the bathroom, you could think of working tungsten flos and fresnels instrument and forget about this window...
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#3 Michael Nash

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 04:33 PM

Now comes my problem! Though I want to create different moods, my concern is how both stocks will cut together. Ideally I would like the flesh tones and colour palettes to match. Has anyone got any experience/examples of how these two stock cut together?

Any help and advise would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!!! :)


This is what tests are for. I realize student budgets are tight, but to really know for yourself how it will cut, you have to see it -- which means test it -- for yourself. Get 100' of each, or shoot some 35mm stills.

And again, you don't say how this film will be posted; film print or telecine? In telecine/video post you have enough image control to smooth out differences between stocks.
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#4 Peter Olney

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Posted 24 March 2008 - 05:18 PM

Thank you both for the feedback! sorry about the late reply i was enjoying easter eggs,,,

We are using the 229 and 205 stocks because the two scenes are intended to look different. However not so different that they jar. Ideally we would use the 205 stock in the classroom aswell, though unfortunately due to our modest lighting package it would be hard to get great results on a dull day ( I live in England and we have plenty of them). I will push to try out the 7219 as you recommended.

Re tests; Unfortunatley we have a capped budget :( I've already spent the camera budget on extra stock to allow a 3:1 ratio (Uni only provides enough for 2:1). The closest I can get is to testing is the Kodak previse programme 'look manager'.

You'll be glad to hear for future projects, I will have a budget to run scratch, steady and stock tests which is a real relief!

The post will be telecine, taken into avid which should allow the image control needed if we do decide to stick with the 229 and 205 stocks.

thanks once again its greatly appreciated.
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#5 Ben Riddell

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Posted 24 March 2008 - 06:26 PM

Hi. I'm Pete's co-DOP / operator on this project.
Michael, you mentioned taking 35mm stills as an alternative to the cost of full tests. I have heard others also mention this possibility but I've searched both the Kodak site and the web in general but can't find anywhere that we might purchase stock adapted for stills.
I assume the perfs match so it is just a matter of having it loaded into a suitable cassette?
Where / how might we go about doing this?
Thanks, Ben
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#6 Laurent Andrieux

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Posted 12 May 2008 - 05:09 PM

You can buy these cassettes in good specialized photo shops. Mind that you may be disapointed when printing on paper, movie film has much more grain than still film (the fact it's projected at 24 fps just washes the grain out). But you may have some idea of colors and contrast.
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