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Special Day Rate ??


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#1 Xavier Plaza

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Posted 05 May 2008 - 03:25 PM

Hi there

I have had to travel for work in some occasion but under a pay (month), this my first time like freelance...It seems my next project could be a ride in others countries i think three different countries and i have a few doubts what it could be my rate...

My first question is do i have to charge any additional percentage to my normal rate because i have to work out of my country?

My second question is i don't know where but i heard when you travel to work to other countries you have to charge to your rate your travels days this time i think it could be a 7 hours flight (each way)... is this true?

Thank you


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#2 Allen Achterberg

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Posted 05 May 2008 - 06:33 PM

Depends on what you require. Nothing is set in stone. I've charged travel rates, if i spend a whole day traveling I will expect some sort of compensation.

You should be given per diem for each day you are out of town. This is petty cash for meals and other misc. stuff you'll need while away.

But you do not HAVE to charge anything, you could do it for free if you wanted to. Talk with them, mention the travel day compensation and the per diem and find out if they have it budgeted in for you.

best
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#3 Xavier Plaza

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Posted 05 May 2008 - 11:28 PM

Thanks Allen you're right i have to talk with the producer about that details. Unfortunately i can't do it for free i love travel but i have enough work in my country and leaving could be the worst decision... Just one thing I'm still doing the same question; Do you think I have to keep the same day rate filming out of my country...??? Something in my mind tell me NO, perhaps i am wrong...


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#4 Daniel Sheehy

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 12:19 AM

There's no real reason to increase your base rate simply because of a change in geographical location. The work you're doing is still the same.

It is fair however to pass on additional expenses brought on by the fact that you're shooting out of your home area... cost of traveling, cost of meals & accommodation etc..
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#5 Allen Achterberg

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 12:48 AM

Daniel is correct, keep your normal base rate, but at least negotiate a Per-Diem and Travel rate. If they have not mention this to you, you can include it into your rate. I would not however do that. I'd ask for the per diem and travel rate, if they cannot pay that it is up to you whether or not to take the job. Try to get what you feel your time is worth, and negotiate to agreeable terms. The production should (if experienced) have all of this budgeted and tell you what they can offer, work with the offer to get your desired deal.

best
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#6 John Brawley

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 01:07 AM

Thanks Allen you're right i have to talk with the producer about that details. Unfortunately i can't do it for free i love travel but i have enough work in my country and leaving could be the worst decision... Just one thing I'm still doing the same question; Do you think I have to keep the same day rate filming out of my country...??? Something in my mind tell me NO, perhaps i am wrong...


Xavier


I normally charge the same day rate no matter where I'm working. However, i will also charge a travel rate, which is normally half my day rate. There is also a per diem on top of this to cover costs for being away from your home, such as meals, laundry etc. This is separate here in australia because it isn't taxed. In other words you don't add it to your invoice because that income is taxable.

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#7 Xavier Plaza

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 09:34 AM

Thank you Allen, Daniel and John you clarify me a lot of questions... I never heard about Per-Diem i understand what it means but are there any percentage (based on your day rate) to know what it could be a normal Per-Diem ???


Once again Thank you guys


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#8 Xavier Plaza

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 09:34 AM

Thank you Allen, Daniel and John you clarify me a lot of questions... I never heard about Per-Diem i understand what it means but are there any percentage (based on your day rate) to know what it could be a normal Per-Diem ???


Once again Thank you guys


Xavier
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#9 John Brawley

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 04:12 PM

but are there any percentage (based on your day rate) to know what it could be a normal Per-Diem ???


Hi Again Xavier.

Here it's basically determined by the official government award, not as a percentage. So they work out $12 for breakfast, $25 for lunch, $30 for dinner etc. It's usually between $75 and $100 (australian) per day.

jb
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#10 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 04:40 PM

Much as I agree with the above, it may not always be reasonable to expect per diems (though you will doubtless recover expenses in other ways.) Not that I think it should be this way, but of the dozens and dozens of times I've worked out of town, I've received per diem on exactly three occasions. Usually there's some excuse about the location of the shoot, regardless of whether you actually have to travel a long way to get there, or even stay locally.

It seems to be a "big hollywood movie" thing, and like many big hollywood movie things, despite the protestations of people with big IMDB resumes that it is the way things are done, it is not actually normal for, well, everywhere that isn't LA.

P
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#11 Xavier Plaza

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 05:08 PM

Thank you John you clarify this point... And Phil perhaps it looks like "big hollywood movie things" yeah perhaps you're right..., but I always know when someone live his country for business you receive an extra money for your expenses...

Anyway thank you for your replies it was a valuable contribution


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#12 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 06:44 PM

Personally my rate is calculated more or less per job and is usually a figure somewhere between what I think it's worth and what I think they'll stand, the former figure including factors like "it's on the other side of the planet".

P
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#13 John Brawley

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 10:10 PM

Much as I agree with the above, it may not always be reasonable to expect per diems (though you will doubtless recover expenses in other ways.) Not that I think it should be this way, but of the dozens and dozens of times I've worked out of town, I've received per diem on exactly three occasions. Usually there's some excuse about the location of the shoot, regardless of whether you actually have to travel a long way to get there, or even stay locally.

It seems to be a "big hollywood movie" thing, and like many big hollywood movie things, despite the protestations of people with big IMDB resumes that it is the way things are done, it is not actually normal for, well, everywhere that isn't LA.

P



Well Phil, I have yet to do a "big hollywood" thing, but I ALWAYS get paid per diems. You just make it a standard part of the deal. In Australia at least it's standard. Why shouldn't you get an away from home allowance. it COSTS you money to be away from home on top of your normal rate.

You need to stand up for your self mate !

jb
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#14 Warwick Hempleman

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Posted 08 May 2008 - 05:46 PM

I agree re: per Diems. Across the continent they're standard practice. Xavier, if you have an accountant ask him / her what the standard per Diem rates are in your country and for travel to neighboring countries. There should be a table readily available which is typically used for government employee actuarial purposes. The amounts listed don't usually cover a decent dinner in a hotel, but they are at least a place to start.

The only alternative I know of to per Diems is the "Big Happy Family" style of location work, wherein the production buys all meals and ancillaries. In days gone by here in Germany, this often extended to the bar tab :P

Travel days are more of a judgement call, as would be standby days (like weekends). In my experience, travel (and/or work) under 5 hours was usually seen as a half day, with more than that being charged as a full day. If you're required to be on a location and not work (holiday, location falls through, etc.) there's compensation to be asked for. Multiweek location shoots plan in down days that are not compensated, but the per Diem still should be paid.
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#15 Xavier Plaza

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Posted 09 May 2008 - 10:20 AM

I agree re: per Diems. Across the continent they're standard practice. Xavier, if you have an accountant ask him / her what the standard per Diem rates are in your country and for travel to neighboring countries. There should be a table readily available which is typically used for government employee actuarial purposes. The amounts listed don't usually cover a decent dinner in a hotel, but they are at least a place to start.

The only alternative I know of to per Diems is the "Big Happy Family" style of location work, wherein the production buys all meals and ancillaries. In days gone by here in Germany, this often extended to the bar tab :P

Travel days are more of a judgement call, as would be standby days (like weekends). In my experience, travel (and/or work) under 5 hours was usually seen as a half day, with more than that being charged as a full day. If you're required to be on a location and not work (holiday, location falls through, etc.) there's compensation to be asked for. Multiweek location shoots plan in down days that are not compensated, but the per Diem still should be paid.




Hi Warwick, My accountant was the first person I ask and the answer was: " just $5 for water that's the all you need" :angry: .... Then I remember why i just visit this guy two times in a year, only for make my bills jajaja :lol: . Then I ask to some colleagues and we agree if someone is in a foreign country you must have the economic freedom to be able to walk and work calm. That at least means to have covers the meals of the day and certain additional expenses. Years ago I direct and produce some TV shows (international beaches in the caribbean) and I remember as a producer at the end of the day several times I ( as producer ) invite the beers obviously just one round...
I almost 30's and never felt I can trust in my government . I'm on my own...
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#16 Michael Nash

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Posted 10 May 2008 - 04:20 AM

Just FYI, this is the first hit on Google for "per diem"

http://www.gsa.gov/P...pe=GSA_OVERVIEW
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#17 Stephen Williams

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Posted 10 May 2008 - 10:04 AM

Hi,

I try to charge my normal day rate for prep & travel, sometimes I get 50%, if I really want to do the job I may not charge anything at all. It's better to charge nothing than a low rate that production puts in their database, that's the rate they will expect next time!

Stephen
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#18 Xavier Plaza

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Posted 10 May 2008 - 11:52 AM

Hi,

I try to charge my normal day rate for prep & travel, sometimes I get 50%, if I really want to do the job I may not charge anything at all. It's better to charge nothing than a low rate that production puts in their database, that's the rate they will expect next time!

Stephen



Great link Michael, thanks... And stephen... interesting..., wise advice


Thanks guys
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