Nagra or a DAT?
Posted 12 February 2004 - 03:50 PM
Very Confused. Any help would be appreciatted.
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Posted 13 February 2004 - 12:43 AM
You can do just fine without timecode as long as you're just doing your own work. If you were going to try to rent the use of this gear or get hired by others in a professional situation then you would really need a timecode machine, but you don't need it for your own work. Simply use a proper clapper slate to verbally and visually mark each take as was always done traditionally. Dump your audio into FCP and line up the sound of the clap with the image of the same. It's quite easy to do and you'll get a hand of it quite quickly. The issue of the running speed is called "resolving" and you don't have to shoot 23.976 to take care of it. There is a function in FCP and in Pro Tools to adjust the audio. Ask on a user's group and I'm sure someone can help you with the details.
The Nagra is a great old machine but I wouldn't spend serious money on one unless I was heading into the harshest of environments and wanted a backup machine. Go with DAT and you'll be fine.
Posted 04 March 2004 - 10:57 AM
Posted 04 March 2004 - 11:15 AM
Posted 04 March 2004 - 03:44 PM
If you record speech, it does not matter if you record digital or analog. Sure digital has its flaws because of low sampling rates, but unless you'll be showing your movies at IMAX and top conventional theaters, the speaker systems are not good enough for anyone to hear the difference.
But the difference is definitely there. Go to some good audio dealer and compare the same recording on CD and SACD. You'll hear the difference. If there would be an SACD recorder -- better than with any analog recorder.
Posted 04 March 2004 - 10:52 PM
Any professional field recorder will serve you well. If you go with Nagra make sure the transfer house still has equipment to deal with it and the person doing post can deal with it as well when they go back and grab original field audio for alternate takes, ambience and other stuff which probably won't get transferred.
I plan on doing a feature on film, and getting it telecined to DV to edit on final cut pro, which is a better system for audio? Nagra or DAT?
All the analog vs digital stuff in this thread is stupid. The real bottom line for getting good sound is a good boom operator who rides the line and points the mic at the mouth of the person talking. I'd rather hear dialog that was recorded on a cheap cassette deck with dolby that was boomed well than one that was recorded on a Deva with a PA operating the mic. If you are the mixer and they give you a PA to boom, better to switch jobs and boom it yourself while the PA pushes the red button and fills out the sound reports. Come post time, audio turd polishing is very expensive and time consuming and all you will have is a polished turd in the end. I also think people would rather see a movie shot on DV with good sound than a movie shot on 35mm that sounds like poop.
Posted 05 March 2004 - 11:48 PM
interesting what you said about visual quality vs. sound quality, in terms of "watchability" i really agree.
Posted 06 March 2004 - 08:55 AM
The other solution much discussed by indie guys is to use a laptop with a balanced XLR interface like the M-Audio mobile USBPRE. 96khz 24 bit for peanuts.
Go to a sound forum and propose this. They love it.
Posted 03 April 2004 - 01:01 AM
Let a sound recordist decide on the best equipment to use...after all, you wouldn't expect them to tell you what camera is best. Anyway a decent recordist will come with all the equipment they need.
"All the analog vs digital stuff in this thread is stupid. The real bottom line for getting good sound is a good boom operator who rides the line and points the mic at the mouth of the person talking."
You will be using a professional recordist and boom op won't you? If not it doesn't matter what it's recorded on,you are at the mercy of the gods. You will find it cheaper to hire the best you can on the shoot rather than to "fix it in post" (trust me on that one.)
Posted 14 July 2004 - 11:58 PM
-still being manufactured
-created from the beginning as a professional machine
-will work in extremes of heat, cold, humidity & dust
-can drop it (to a certain extent of course) and it will still work
-non existent list of problems with unit reported on sound web pages and
-quality of sound recorded is warm & rich
-Fostex and HHB have discontinued their time code DAT recorders
-tape transport mechanisms are not manufactured anymore for DAT recorders
-created from the beginning as a consumer format that failed
-will crease working in extremes of climate
-if dropped, most likely will be unrepairable
-regular postings of problems on film sound webpages and newsgroups
-being 16 bit, the quality of sound is colder and more limited
Prices for Nagras and DAT's are coming down as the new generation of non linear hard disk/DVD audio recorders come out. (There are 10 machines from 6 different companies out or on the way)
Posted 10 August 2004 - 12:46 AM
You'll also have to digitize in real time, and deal with pull up / down, take notes, etc. in the field.
DAT, on the other hand is pretty well a dead meduim. Don't waste your dough. There amy be one company left making a field DAT recorder. However, if you find a used Fostex PD-4 or an HHB, they were very good and reliable 24 bit machines with time code options. They were used for many major motion pictures.
Currently, most pro's are using hard disk recorders. Currently, they are quite expensive, but there will be some relatively low cost options very soon. Zaxcom will be refurbishing their immensely popular DEVA II recorder /mixer from trade-ins. Sound Devices will be releasing their long awaited 722 & 744 recorders at a record breaking price of $1,000.00 per channel (2 & 4 channel).
A bit less expensive (and available now) is the Fostex FR-2 recorder which uses CF cards and PCMCIA hard disk cards at around $1300.00. It is a high quiality 24 bit recorder with a time code board available soon.
A rung lower on the ladder is the Marants PMD670 CF recorder for around $700.00
Digital recorders will store production info, tape info, etc. right on the tape as data and will export the files directly to your NLS editor.
Posted 23 September 2004 - 07:33 PM
MOTU makes 24bit 192khz stuff which I've heard a lot of analog freaks say is getting really really close to converting them.
The primary downside is that it doesn't run off batteries
Posted 24 September 2004 - 09:03 AM