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Medium Format lenses/PL adapter


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#1 jeff zueger

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Posted 17 July 2008 - 05:16 PM

HI all, new to this forum, so I apologize if this topic has been discussed already I'm sure it probably has. Has anyone had any experience using medium format Hasselblad lenses with a PL adapter for 35mm, actually S35mm production. There seems to be an abundance of them on EBAY for pretty reasonable prices (considering the current shortage of PL prime lenses) Is there any issues, besides the focal length factor, in using these lenses. Hard to get step up/down rings, finding focus gears (etc.)?? I would think this would be a nice set up using the sweet spot of an already high quality lens. I know they tend to be a little slow, but I shoot alot of tourism/slice of life stuff which 95% is outdoors. Looks like a great forum and I hope someone can shed some light on any experiences they have had with this type of set up. Thanks
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#2 David Auner aac

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Posted 18 July 2008 - 01:22 AM

Hi Jeff,

do a search, the topic has been discussed quite recently. To sum it up, I wouldn't recommend doing that. Reasons are given in the old thread.

Cheers, Dave
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#3 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 18 July 2008 - 02:03 AM

HI all, new to this forum, so I apologize if this topic has been discussed already I'm sure it probably has. Has anyone had any experience using medium format Hasselblad lenses with a PL adapter for 35mm, actually S35mm production.....


The Hasselblad lenses can be use for film shooting and flange ofcal distance of Hasselblad lenses compatible with PL mount.
But. Hasselblad lenses have too high price, that's why do not use at film shooting too much.
As for me, I do not know of Hasselblad-PL mount adapter.

From other side, The lenses of mediun format photo cameras with Pentacom Six, Kiev-60 lens mount can be use at film shooting. This is lenses, made in Carl Zeiss, USSR, Ukraine, have low price and high optical characteristics.
The special series can be Tilt-Shift lenses.

If anybody need lens mount adapter for install of lenses with Pentacon Six, Kiev-60, Kiev-6 lens mount on Arri Pl lens mount cameras, let me know. I will inform, where you can buy.
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#4 georg lamshöft

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Posted 18 July 2008 - 08:57 AM

The lenses from "Carl Zeiss Jena" have very little to do with real Carl Zeiss lenses!

Jena (Eastern Germany) was the hometown of Carl Zeiss, after WW2 they realized the Russians weren't interested in helping them, many highly-skilled specialists flee from weak economy, low wages and well, missing democracy/freedom... So most of the know-how, technology, people and machines (what survived the war) were quickly transfered to Oberkochen (Western Germany). After 1989, Carl Zeiss Jena was 40 years behind in quality/technology and couldn't survive the market, so Carl Zeiss Oberkochen reinvested in Jena (Jenoptik etc.).

I had some Eastern Germany-cameras/lenses, I wouldn't even dare to call them high-quality.

Edited by georg lamshöft, 18 July 2008 - 08:57 AM.

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#5 jeff zueger

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Posted 18 July 2008 - 10:03 AM

Thanks everyone for your input. I figured it had been talked about before but when I searched Hasselblad nothing came up. I will look again and try to dig some stuff up. I did find a blad to PL adapter and thats what got me starting to think this may be viable option. Thanks again
Jeff
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#6 David Auner aac

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Posted 18 July 2008 - 11:03 AM

I had some Eastern Germany-cameras/lenses, I wouldn't even dare to call them high-quality.


I'd be very careful with a generalization like that. Many knowledgeable camera people and photographers swear by Zeiss Jena lenses. And then again, what is high quality in the film world anyway? I'd rather shoot a movie on Cooke Kinetals from the 50s if it fits the story better even if I had MkIII Superspeeds!

Cheers, Dave
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#7 georg lamshöft

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Posted 18 July 2008 - 06:48 PM

I grew up with the separation of Germany, saw production sites on both sides, have relatives on both sides working in the industry.
My engineer's view:
It's simply a desaster, it's unbelieveable how much knowledge and skill was destroyed by ignorance - some of the most advanced technology once came from regions in Eastern Germany (like the first 35mm-SLR-camera, watches...) but after WW2 the Russians destroyed everything that was left by the war with no intention in reconstruction like in Western Germany by USA/England/France.

In the end 99% of the eastern industry was focused on producing for the communist world or cheap exports with old machines, old know-how, too few skilled people and constant lack of materials! Have you ever driven a Eastern German car? Well, you haven't missed anything...

When we talk about quality, we mean it in a scientific, technical way. I just wanted to say that you have to be very careful when you expect comparable quality of "Carl Zeiss Jena" just because of the similar name or older products before WW2 - it's more familiar to Russian standards (works somehow...) and no cheap alternative to "Made in Germany"-lenses!
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#8 David Auner aac

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Posted 19 July 2008 - 02:29 AM

When we talk about quality, we mean it in a scientific, technical way. I just wanted to say that you have to be very careful when you expect comparable quality of "Carl Zeiss Jena" just because of the similar name or older products before WW2 - it's more familiar to Russian standards (works somehow...) and no cheap alternative to "Made in Germany"-lenses!


On that we can agree. And then again some Russian lenses are rally sought after too, like Lomos. So I guess it really depends of the lens specimen at hand.

Cheers, Dave
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#9 David Auner aac

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Posted 19 July 2008 - 02:32 AM

Thanks everyone for your input. I figured it had been talked about before but when I searched Hasselblad nothing came up. I will look again and try to dig some stuff up. I did find a blad to PL adapter and thats what got me starting to think this may be viable option.


Here's one of the recent thread (kinda on the topic): Medium Format Lenses on Video Cameras

Regards, Dave
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#10 jeff zueger

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Posted 19 July 2008 - 02:44 AM

Hey all, didn't mean to start any sort of controversy on lens history here, which I am no expert. Simply trying to get some sound info on the viability of using these lenses in a S35mm application. This may be a stupid question, but are all Hasselblad medium format lenses "Jennas"? The lenses I was refering to are all T*s. Distagon 4/40mm/50mm, Planar 2.8/80mm/Planar /3.5 100mm and Sonnar 150mm. I don't see "Jenna" anywhere on any of them. I have seen "Jenna" on ziess lenses before, but there is no reference to it on any of the ones I'm looking at. Not saying one way or the other, just curious. Anyway, I searched back to the begining of this thread (Lenses and Lens Accessories) and have found nothing on the topic. Also tried searching medium format (etc.) Maybe it is another thread?
Be good.
Jeff
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#11 jeff zueger

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Posted 19 July 2008 - 02:52 AM

Sorry not Jennas...Jenas.
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#12 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 19 July 2008 - 07:03 AM

I had some Eastern Germany-cameras/lenses, I wouldn't even dare to call them high-quality.


I wish underline, this is my personal opinion only.
I do not like to discuss about any political questions of production of Carl Zeiss lenses.
I wish told about optical characteristics and question of filmmaking only.
I test of many type of cine and photo lenses on optical bench and to draw attention to result of optical test at first, do not on brand name of lens.
From other side, i draw attention on real price of this lens now.
And As for me, if you think about low budget set of lenses, you need choose of best rate between price and optical quality of lens.
That's why, i recommed to draw attention on lenses with Pentacon Six , Kiev-60, Kiev-6 lens mount.
This can be russian Jupiter, Kaleynar, Volna, Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar.

As for me, i use of this lenses for my personal film shooting too.
And the personal style of image of Carl Zeiss Sonnar do not repeat of modern, brand name, cine lenses.
I told about Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar 180 mm F2.8 last edition with MC.
This is lenses have low price on ebay now, that's why, can be very good alternative.
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#13 georg lamshöft

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 03:06 PM

@Jeff
Every real Carl Zeiss lens says: "Made in Germany" or "Lens made in Germany" - ALL other lenses are either produced by others to cut costs (and usually differently designed to fit the skills of these producers - like most "Zeiss"-branded-lenses for todays rangefinder-cameras or Nikon/Pentax (all Cosina) or most of the old Contax/Kyocera-lenses) or are old lenses manufactured by Carl Zeiss Jena (as already said: different company, different skills) till ~1989.

Alle cine-lenses and the Hasselblad-lenses are REAL Carl Zeiss with all it's advantages/disadvantages. Carl Zeiss is more than just a brand, it's a company with more than 160 years of experience, the Oberkochen-production-site is the most advanced lens-production-site in the world! And the Carl Zeiss foundation also owns the world's biggest/most advanced technical glass-producer: Schott (everybody knows Ceran) which also produces most of the glass for Zeiss-lenses! But they're expensive...


@Olex
It's interesting that you mention the Sonnar 2,8/180. The Jena-version is based on a design of 1936 (that's why it's often called Olympia-Sonnar") when Carl Zeiss Jena still was real Carl Zeiss.

"This is lenses have low price on ebay now, that's why, can be very good alternative"

That's true and I'm sure you can find people who need exactly what Carl Zeiss Jena-lenses have to offer! But speaking of an "alternative" people usually start to think of Carl Zeiss Jena as an alternative to real Carl Zeiss.

I didn't want to start a political discussion either, but when I talk badly about these products (Zeiss Jena, Praktica...) people usually come up with personal, positive experiences. The reason and the scientific cause of the quality difference between "Eastern Germany" and "Made in Germany"-products lies within political/social reasons, besides personal, singular experience/subjective impression there are huge differences in the way these products were designed and manufactured.

Edited by georg lamshöft, 27 July 2008 - 03:07 PM.

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#14 K Borowski

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 03:22 PM

IMHO, as I said in several threads pertaining to this topic before, good 35mm glass is sharper than MF glass, even Carl Zeiss. Get some 35mm Zeiss lenses instead. You'll have better F/stops and sharper images. For the ultimate in sharpness, try to minimize filtration in front of the lens and stop down two stops from the maximum aperture.

Nothing wrong with MF glass, just that it shouldn't be used unless you're shooting 65mm through your camera! As has been discussed before, the physical size makes the process more problematic at these larger lens sizes.
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#15 jeff zueger

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 03:04 PM

Well put...Thanks Karl...that is what I was hoping to hear.
Jeff
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#16 Phil Soheili

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 03:44 AM

If anybody need lens mount adapter for install of lenses with Pentacon Six, Kiev-60, Kiev-6 lens mount on Arri Pl lens mount cameras, let me know. I will inform, where you can buy.


Hello Olex,
I thought it would be great if you could name a few sources for a CZ-Hassi to PL Adapter...
I have all the lenses from 30 to 500 and would want to test them on my ARRI S16.

Thank you and good day everybody.
Phil

Edited by Phil Soheili, 11 April 2012 - 03:45 AM.

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