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Nikon Camera that shoots 24fps 720p


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#1 Jonathan Bryant

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Posted 28 August 2008 - 03:29 PM

http://imaging.nikon...d90/en/d-movie/
For only $1000 how do you think this would do as HD camera? The only major drawback I have seen so far is that it blacks out the viewfinder in movie mode, so you are left with the lcd though you could mark you focus pulls.
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#2 Allen Achterberg

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Posted 28 August 2008 - 03:41 PM

Well certainly it has a mirror reflex and in order for the image sensor to shoot continuous video that would have to be out of the way thus blacking the viewfinder. I see it as a cool little toy that may have some good uses. I wouldnt shoot a serious project with it. We talk about it in General discussion already...


its neat


In Fact, I wonder if a Beam splitter in place of that mirror wouldnt lend a solution to the black viewfinder...maybe it would cause issues but Im very curious now that if you removed the mirror shutter, and replaced it with a beam splitter glass if you could not shoot clear video while looking through the finder.

Edited by Allen Achterberg, 28 August 2008 - 03:44 PM.

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#3 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 28 August 2008 - 04:12 PM

I've looked at a couple of cameras that had live view functionality for this sort of thing. In many ways it's ideal - big sensor, nice lenses, stacks of resolution. The problem has always been viewfinding as both the LCD and HDMI outputs are often too laggy to use, and the optical viewfinder is, as has been correctly surmised, unusable.

I also wonder if the 720p image is windowed off the sensor. I would suspect that it is, which will mean you're looking at a really small chunk of the big chip. Exactly what the manufacturers choose to call a 720p area of their big sensor is another matter.

P
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#4 Stephen Williams

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Posted 28 August 2008 - 04:17 PM

I've looked at a couple of cameras that had live view functionality for this sort of thing. In many ways it's ideal - big sensor, nice lenses, stacks of resolution. The problem has always been viewfinding as both the LCD and HDMI outputs are often too laggy to use, and the optical viewfinder is, as has been correctly surmised, unusable.

I also wonder if the 720p image is windowed off the sensor. I would suspect that it is, which will mean you're looking at a really small chunk of the big chip. Exactly what the manufacturers choose to call a 720p area of their big sensor is another matter.

P


Phil,

I don't believe it is windowed, there are some shots with a fisheye lens. Don't know how they get the 720p.

Stephen
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#5 Jonathan Bryant

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Posted 28 August 2008 - 04:37 PM

What do you guys think of Scarlet. Though it is a different animal it, stuff like this is making me second guess my EX1 purchase.
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#6 A. Whitehouse

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 10:55 PM

What do you guys think of Scarlet. Though it is a different animal it, stuff like this is making me second guess my EX1 purchase.


I wouldn't second guess it for a moment. Both this and the Scarlet (which is probably still being designed but Ive seen renders and am speculating) look like horrible cameras to try and operate unless they're hooked up to some sort of mount and rig. Whereas the Sony is beautiful to use and by all reports seem to produce a very nice image. Ergonomically the other two are a nightmare (At least at this stage), does the Scarlet really have its lens controls on the butt of the camera?.

I guess its safe to say the resolution and fps of the video will increase on stills in the coming years, some really interesting effects could be created using all that image area
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#7 Saul Rodgar

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Posted 31 August 2008 - 12:08 PM

Phil,

I don't believe it is windowed, there are some shots with a fisheye lens. Don't know how they get the 720p.

Stephen


The D90 has a DX sized sensor, approximately 24×16 mm. A bit smaller than the size of 4 perf 35mm aperture. WAAY bigger than 1/3, 1/2, 2/3 inch chips on most video cams, including Scarlet . . . Looks like a winner!

http://imaging.nikon...r/d90/index.htm

http://en.wikipedia....Nikon_DX_format

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_35
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#8 Sam Wells

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Posted 31 August 2008 - 01:04 PM

. Don't know how they get the 720p.

Stephen


I don't either but they must have been thinking this capability when they designed the Exspeed processor (they've had 1080i out via HDMI since the D3 introduction....) agree about the lagginess, I rarely use Live view on my D3 - it's a videotap at this point really

-Sam
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#9 Mitch Gross

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Posted 01 September 2008 - 01:19 AM

The camera uses binning to supersample its sensor down to 1280x720. So it actually shoots Super-35 depth of field & field of view.
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#10 David Auner aac

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Posted 01 September 2008 - 01:53 AM

agree about the lagginess, I rarely use Live view on my D3 - it's a videotap at this point really


Well, I first thought that LiveView was more a gimmick than anything useful, but I've found uses for it on my D300. E.g. when you have the camera up against a wall, you can't look into the finder anymore. Here LiveView comes in handy. Or when doing reproductions of artwork it saves you the hassle to screw on the 90 deg finder. It also comes in handy for extremely critical focusing since you can zoom into the picture to around 10x magnification. But still, it's not something I'd miss if I didn't have it.

Cheers, Dave
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#11 Saul Rodgar

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Posted 01 September 2008 - 11:33 AM

Now, if the Nikon engineers just modified the software to use the full resolution of the chip to 4K + (instead of downsampling it to 720p) and added hard drive recording, RAW capabilities, over and undercranking with a mp film camera body for about $15,000 or cheaper -RED would have a massively serious competitor.

Or even better, they could just design a digital magazine to fit existing 35mm mp cameras, the way Aaton is allegedly doing. That way there would be a mechanical shutter involved and a proven hardware platform to the digital technology. That would certainly make it less available to independents, but still.

I realize it is easier asking than doing it, but the market is there -and they seem to be in the right track with the technology, maybe even halfway there? I just can't believe no one beside RED is taking the challenge to provide 4 perf 35 mm sized sensor digital mp cameras at an somewhat affordable price point.

As much as I love film, there is no denying the industry is moving to full digital acquisition sooner than later.

Edited by Saul Rodgar, 01 September 2008 - 11:38 AM.

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#12 Kristian Schumacher

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Posted 01 September 2008 - 02:29 PM

Now, if the Nikon engineers just modified the software to use the full resolution of the chip to 4K + (instead of downsampling it to 720p)


Hmmm.. I have a feeling there may take more than a simple software upgrade to deliver full DSLR resolution at 24 fps, but I like the idea... I wouldn't be surprised to see a high resolution Nikon video camera with full 36x24 frame and f-mount in the next few years...
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#13 Sam Wells

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Posted 01 September 2008 - 04:39 PM

As much as I love film, there is no denying the industry is moving to full digital acquisition sooner than later.


Which both drives all this but at the same time is why everyone is not diving headfirst into the deep end - they're letting RED do this :o :) as it's a shift in engineering direction ---

I'd love it if I had my D3's chip in a 24 fps camera with full "4K" (in quotes to avoid THAT barfight Round 12) & even the form factor would work for me (but not everyone) but there are issues with viewing system (scary enough to flap that mirror as fast as it does) and shutter (a disk would be better but now we've rebuilt the box) etc.

ps David I'm glad to have Live View also but in my case surprised how little I've used it...

-Sam
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#14 John Sprung

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Posted 02 September 2008 - 03:41 PM

Now, if the Nikon engineers just modified the software to use the full resolution of the chip to 4K + (instead of downsampling it to 720p) and added hard drive recording, RAW capabilities, ....

It's more a hardware issue. The problem is moving and storing a lot more bits fast enough. This is the kind of thing that leads to stuff like the Bradley vehicle.... ;-)




-- J.S.
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