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#1 Jamie Metzger

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Posted 21 September 2008 - 07:31 PM

Hey guys,
I am helping a friend on a music video. He is trying to accomplish a pretty broad top light over the 4 band members. On the ground, there will be a grid of black light tape. We have considered space lights, covered wagons, and image 80s (with black light bulbs). The space lights and covered wagons would need Congo Blue, with has very little light transmission; leading us to figuring out the proper height for exposure at ISO 250.


Anyone have relatively cheap suggestions? How about using real black light; is this a problem while shooting 35mm?

Thank you,
Jamie
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#2 Walter Graff

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Posted 21 September 2008 - 08:46 PM

Whatever you decide, just remember that black lights can seriously damage your eyes. Your crew needs to wear eye protection, whether it be cheap store bought black lights or pro lights, it doesn't take much for serious damage.
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#3 Glenn Dawes

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Posted 25 September 2008 - 11:45 AM

Whatever you decide, just remember that black lights can seriously damage your eyes. Your crew needs to wear eye protection, whether it be cheap store bought black lights or pro lights, it doesn't take much for serious damage.


I'm shooting a cop drama (Draught of Violence) and was planning to use a light-bulb type 75 watt black-light in the cop car as the corrupt cops throw 2 suspects into the back seat. The director asked me to come up with a purple light FX on them. One is black and the other is white. Director wants a purple edge light around the black suspect.

Camera is XL-1 with X16 lens. Lighting kit is 8 custom built MR16 (20-50w for inside the cars), 1 Kw Red head. 500 w Fresnel, custom par64 cans, 1 - 5 milloin candle pwr spot (Cop search light doubles as a key/FX light), plus a crate of assorted photo-floods for practicals and various other soft bounce lighting/fill rigs.

Shooting at night.
Have cash to buy/rent whatever is needed to make the fx work/gels/nothing too big.

Thanks.
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#4 Glenn Dawes

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Posted 25 September 2008 - 11:57 AM

I'm shooting a cop drama (Draught of Violence) and was planning to use a light-bulb type 75 watt black-light in the cop car as the corrupt cops throw 2 suspects into the back seat. The director asked me to come up with a purple light FX on them. One is black and the other is white. Director wants a purple edge light around the black suspect.

Camera is XL-1 with X16 lens. Lighting kit is 8 custom built MR16 (20-50w for inside the cars), 1 Kw Red head. 500 w Fresnel, custom par64 cans, 1 - 5 milloin candle pwr spot (Cop search light doubles as a key/FX light), plus a crate of assorted photo-floods for practicals and various other soft bounce lighting/fill rigs.

Shooting at night.
Have cash to buy/rent whatever is needed to make the fx work/gels/nothing too big.

Thanks.



This is my first post. pushed the wrong button: I am just wondering about the safety factor mentioned. The black light I am thinking of using is the party bulb variety (75 watts) and I have also lit concerts using 24 of the 42 inch tube black lights. The shot is only a few seconds as the two actors are thrown into the back seat of the cop car. If I scrim or flag it to minimise the exposure to the eyes, would this settup be safe enought? Actor to bulb distance will be 2-4 ft.
Thanks again.
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#5 Glenn Dawes

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Posted 26 September 2008 - 01:17 PM

Update:

Slept on the idea and came up with a better approach using the black-lite: The 2 cops are really undercover spooks, so I thought of simulating the saturated blue strip light used in the back window of embassy cars (To enable nite follow-on in a convoy), but instead of aiming it back, aim it to the back of the heads of the 2 suspects (safer for them, but I will flag the spill so I don`t get baked by the UV at the camera possition).

The black actor sitting on the right back seat will turn his head to the right 90 deg. and into the pool of light that we want. He will only be exposed momentarly, even if we do several takes. The script calls for him to curse the cop through the right back window, so it will work well. I am also going to use a 300 w pepper with a saturated purple to use on faces forward of the BG BlackLight.

I think posting it here stirred up my creative sleep!.
Principle Photo starts tonight in Ottawa at 1930 est.
Cheers!
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#6 Mitch Lusas

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Posted 26 September 2008 - 07:50 PM

I, too, am curious as to how Black Light is dangerous. While it can cause skin cancer, the risk, I've heard, is about the same as from sun exposure. Are there any other risks?
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#7 Walter Graff

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Posted 26 September 2008 - 08:29 PM

I, too, am curious as to how Black Light is dangerous. While it can cause skin cancer, the risk, I've heard, is about the same as from sun exposure. Are there any other risks?



Absolutely! High intensity UV light damages cells in the eyes. Some of you may notice everything looks blurry after working with UV lights. This is because your eyes have been damaged and it takes a bit of time for your eyes to recover. UV is beyond purple on a rainbow. You can't see it. There are three wavelengths you get in an ordinary day, long medium and short (A,B,C). Most of the black lights you use (other than those used in medical for sterilization) are long or A type. It does not cause sunburn but does destroy collagen in the eyes and skin nevertheless. The coating on your eye that protects the lens is collagen. Hence the blurriness after you are exposed to black lights for some time. Your eye constantly replenishes it's collagen (vitamin C is crucial for that).

The reason black lights look purple is that they have a type of filtration coating called a Woods filter which blocks most visible light while allowing UVs to pass. Remember that even an incandescent light emits UVs but also the rest of the spectrum. Coat the bulb with a Woods filter and you block most of the visible light and get lots of UV. It's also the reason these lights get so hot, all the filtration is absorbing such spectrums as infrared, etc. So most of the lamps you buy are long UV type.

But there are two potential issues. First, sitting car with a black light a foot from your face and you are getting a heavier dose of UV than you would if you were in a club and UV lights were 40 feet in the air. Secondly, there is no regulation or standard for making these lamps for entertainment. Being most are made in China, who knows how much filtration is being used or how much of shorter wavelengths are being emitted.

Bottom line, close proximity, long term exposure to UV is dangerous, whether it be a 25 watt lamp in a car or a room filled with UV fluorescents. The collagen is literally burning off your eye when you sit near a IV light. So if you work with one, wear UV filtering specs (most any glasses will do it). And take lots of vitamin C which is needed to for proper collagen production to help make what you are destroying in your eye.

Any lamp you buy will have warning to wear protective glasses and/or not remain in close proximity while operating it. Example:

"WARNING: This lamp emits ultraviolet (uv) power during operation. Protective eyewear should be worn in occupational situations involving long term exposure in close proximity to the lamp."

http://www.buylighti...t-350-s/191.htm

Hope that answers your question.
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#8 Mitch Lusas

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Posted 26 September 2008 - 11:52 PM

Thanks Walter, very thorough answer. Hopefully contacts (most have UV protection) offer some protection. Thanks again, much appreciated.
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#9 Jamie Metzger

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Posted 03 October 2008 - 12:32 PM

So...My eyes still hurt and I definitely avoided looking at the black lights as much as possible.

We ended up using Wildfire Black lights Fixtures rented from Phoebus lighting in San Francisco. We got a great deal on them and want to thank Michael Garret for his help!

The wildfires are pretty damn heavy, but they output a decent amount of light. The are 400w, and look like a square 1k Baby. We used TVMP adapters to put them on stands. We did run into a situation where people tried to help lift the lights while on the stands because of their weight and someone got hurt. I still recommend 1 person raising the light like any normal light, but with extra muscle behind it.

I will post photos in a few days.

Thanks again guys!
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rebotnix Technologies

Abel Cine

CineTape

Rig Wheels Passport

Visual Products

Aerial Filmworks

Ritter Battery

Willys Widgets

FJS International, LLC

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Glidecam

Opal

Tai Audio

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Metropolis Post

Technodolly

The Slider