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why oes one use FLD filter?


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#1 Shubham Kasera

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Posted 14 February 2009 - 12:27 AM

hello
i am about to shoot my diploma films
i will be shooting in a area which will be lit up by 20 CFL tubes.
i am using 500T stock. I would be using 85 filter n rathe my 35mm stock at 320ASA

should i also use a FLD filter? whats the compensation for it?
what will happen if i dont use a FLD filter?
i will also use a few HMI's and Kino flo lights..
please tell me what should i do?
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#2 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 14 February 2009 - 02:26 AM

You'd use the FL-B if using tungsten stock and shooting under Cool White fluorescents. It has both magenta (to cancel green) and orange (to correct 4700K to 3200K.)

The FL-D merely has the magenta element to cancel the green.

If you combined the FL-D and an 85 filter, you'd be over-correcting the blueness of the Cool Whites, since they are 4700K, not 5500K.

But using these filters implies that all other light sources in the frame have been gelled to match the same color as the Cool Whites.

So the question is what is easier to make all one color? The HMI's + daylight Kinos, the overhead Cool White fluorescents, the daytime windows? Is it easier to gel the HMI's, Kinos, and windows to match the fluorescents? Is it easier to gel the overhead fluorescents? Is it easier to replace them with corrected tube like the Kinos are using? Is it easier to put the same Cool White tubes in the Kinos as are overhead, then gel the HMI's and windows to match?

You could just try a CC#20Magenta or CC#30Magenta instead of the FLD or FLB on the camera, or just have the green corrected in post.
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#3 Shubham Kasera

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Posted 14 February 2009 - 02:58 AM

thanks for the reply
well i could get the HMIs and the kinos to match the CFL tubes
but i want the green shadows, slight tints
should i just shoot with 85 and correct a lil bit in the post?
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#4 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 14 February 2009 - 11:24 AM

You could do that, or use an 81EF instead if you don't have enough light for the 85, or the LLD. Shoot a grey scale under what you consider "white" light at the head of the roll, with your filter.
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#5 Freya Black

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Posted 14 February 2009 - 11:59 AM

You could also get a video camera (or digi still camera for that matter) and set it to tungsten balance and then experiment and see how it affects the image in the camera using the different filters.

Just to give yourself a better idea about how you might go about things.
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#6 James Steven Beverly

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Posted 15 February 2009 - 01:56 AM

Freya!! I wondered where you've been hiding. :) How ya doin'? Have you shot anything with your Knovas lately? I'm glad you're still looking in from time to time. Glad to see you're posting again. B)

Edited by James Steven Beverly, 15 February 2009 - 01:57 AM.

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#7 Shubham Kasera

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Posted 15 February 2009 - 06:20 AM

You could also get a video camera (or digi still camera for that matter) and set it to tungsten balance and then experiment and see how it affects the image in the camera using the different filters.

Just to give yourself a better idea about how you might go about things.


hello
i am plannin got shoot with 85 filter as i will using HMI's as well as Kino's
i was looking to have greenish shadows as it is a hospital scene,
i will click some pictures tomo and post here
thanks
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#8 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 15 February 2009 - 08:32 AM

You could also get a video camera (or digi still camera for that matter) and set it to tungsten balance and then experiment and see how it affects the image in the camera using the different filters.

Just to give yourself a better idea about how you might go about things.


Unfortunately or fortunately, depending on how you look at it, video cameras aren't as green sensitive as film, so you don't get that interesting green effect with florescent lighting.
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#9 Shubham Kasera

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Posted 15 February 2009 - 09:46 AM

Unfortunately or fortunately, depending on how you look at it, video cameras aren't as green sensitive as film, so you don't get that interesting green effect with florescent lighting.


hello
i had the same discussion with my professor and i was told the same thing
i will try to get a 35mm still camera tomorrow and click a few stills of the corridor with different filters and send it to developing
will try to post the results soon here

could anyone tell me what effect will 81EF filter have on a tungsten stock?
thanks
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#10 Freya Black

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Posted 15 February 2009 - 10:56 AM

Unfortunately or fortunately, depending on how you look at it, video cameras aren't as green sensitive as film, so you don't get that interesting green effect with florescent lighting.


Ah! That explains why you see people gelling tubes with green or cyan gel on video shoots. :)
I've never shot film under flo's tho I've seen the effect, I'd always assumed they did something to exaggerate it.

Interesting.

Thanks for that Brian, no plans for anything like that right now but who knows what might come up in the future! :)

It does beg the question why you see video cameras being sold with FLD filters mind you!

love

Freya

Edited by Freya Black, 15 February 2009 - 11:00 AM.

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#11 Shubham Kasera

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Posted 15 February 2009 - 11:25 AM

Ah! That explains why you see people gelling tubes with green or cyan gel on video shoots. :)
I've never shot film under flo's tho I've seen the effect, I'd always assumed they did something to exaggerate it.

Interesting.


hello
well havin fluorescent tubes are a little green in color which is not really captured by the digital format as its not as sensitive as film is
shooting with film will have a greenish tone to it, however this is not really very much
ill try to push the key though HMI's a little harder to create some highlight which will give proper skin tone
n let the tubes go without any correction as it is a hospital interior
i am thinking green here will add to my purpose
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#12 Freya Black

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Posted 15 February 2009 - 03:58 PM

Freya!! I wondered where you've been hiding. :) How ya doin'? Have you shot anything with your Knovas lately? I'm glad you're still looking in from time to time. Glad to see you're posting again. B)



Awww screw it, I will post this anyway...

I have to say that I have not shot any film in about 3 years, maybe a little less to be fair but something like that.

I had some very bad experiences a few years back and ran into some people who were bad people basically and bullied me and tore my life to shreds. (not that there was much to my life anyway but I had worked like a dog for many years to create it and I had kind of become attached to it). Anyway in the end, due to the nature of the people in question, I ended up having to remove myself from that whole scene largely. Unfortunately that was the part of my life that involved making films. Anyway on the upside I learnt a fantastic amount from the whole experience and am a good deal less naieve than I used to be which is great as hopefully it means I won't have to sit cringing through future Lars Von Trier films.

After all that I hoped to find a new kind of way of looking at film but the recent collapse of the pound made me realise I was unlikely to be shooting film any time soon as I was reliant on the states for cheap access to telecine etc. I hoped I would do some things with video but over time this seemed more marginal too.

I had largely put film and video things out of my mind till one day I found a small roll of Lee 1/2 minus green in the street. Quite a shock as I had kind of written off that part of my life. Just finding it made me wonder if I might become involved in cinematic things again. It seemed silly to consider but it also seemed so incongrous to find such a thing lying there waiting for me. It was quite odd.

Then more recently I was listenining a lot to to a song by PULP called "something changed". It is about how someones life changes suddenly because something happens they didn't expect or plan for and everything seems different in a way they could never have known. I would listen to it and think, this is what I need to happen in my life right now (not meeting some boy or even Jarvis Cocker but something that would change everything).

One day I woke up and a few hours later I was on my way to a dental appointment (I'd been surviving off magical thinking and chocolate for the last couple of years) and on my way there, something changed which made everything different. Suddenly things didn't seem quite as desperate and hopeless as they had a few hours ago. I was never playing to win anyway, in fact "Tora! Tora! Tora!" was the film that saved my life when I was about 13/14 or something but as you get older you just get more tired I guess, now everything was so different,

The knock on effect means that I might be shooting a film after all. I'm both excited and scared at the prospect, as I've not made anything in ages, the scale of the project is much bigger than anything I've done before, and I'm probably going to have to learn a bunch of stuff fast. However I've done loads of impossible things in my life and it should be fun, and basically I believe I can do it somehow. :)

I was about to say something about it might not happen but that things are going to be amazing either way or stuff like that, but I just got the word and it looks like its going to happen...

eeeeek!

Thanks for asking after me James! Wow Black is back! :)

love

Freya
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#13 James Steven Beverly

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Posted 16 February 2009 - 12:43 AM

Black IS back!! Rock On, Baby!!! A roll of Lee 1/2 minus green just lyin' there in the street for you to find. Amazing! God does work in mysterious ways. We missed ya. Oh and call me Steve B)

Edited by James Steven Beverly, 16 February 2009 - 12:46 AM.

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