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Movie lighting for photographer / What kind of lithing is there ?


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#1 Daniel Bestem

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 03:14 AM

I am photographer and I would like to make a switch from flash lights to movie lights.
Can any one tell me what kind of film lighting do I need to achive such effects ?. Take a look at those pictures. I have also attached some pictures and movies from BACKSTAGE where you can actually see the lights that this photographer used.

I've got a few questions :
1. Is 6KW HMI FRESNEL enough ?
2. Would it be cheaper to use 6KW TUNGSTEN lights + gel filters ?
3. What is the advantge of using PAR HMI instead of FRESNEL HMI ?

http://www.marieclai...vita-da-bambola
http://www.marieclai...e-di-shiny-doll


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#2 Adrian Sierkowski

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 05:21 AM

The answer for all of that is, it depends.
It depends on what F stop you want, it depends on what color balance you want, it depends on your desired shutter speed etc etc etc...
There aren't any 6K Tungsten lights, you'd need to use a 5K, and then you'd loose exposure converting that to daylight (though no one says you have to, it could be a nice golden tone w/o the CTB). The tungsten head also would be a cheaper rental. But your biggest problem will be powering a 5K or 6K lamp. You'd need 50 or 60 amps to do it, and that's just not gonna be found in a house-hold circuit. So now you also need a genny and someone who knows how to run it safely.
The difference between a PAR and an Fresnel is that you can change out lenses on Par lights and really throw the light a long way with the NS and VNS lenses. The Fresnel, however, is a bit easier to work with as you have more control over the beam in terms of flood---spot. Generally, Pars are used as a farther throw hard source or I tend to like to bounce them off of, or push them through something as a soft light.
I would recommend getting acquainted with smaller cine lights first before moving up to 5 and 6Ks HMIs and the like that or partner up with a gaffer who knows the heads and can help show you the ropes of 'em.

And last but not least, you must post under your REAL NAME here as per for forum rules. Please go to "my controls" on the upper right corner of your page, and then, once it loads look on the middle left hand column for "change display name" and input your real name.
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#3 David Rakoczy

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 06:56 AM

FILM LIGHTING
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#4 Steve McBride

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 05:08 PM

Assuming you mean using cine lights for still photography, from the images you've shown it looks like two-point lighting with a hard key and soft fill.

Getting an Arri tungsten kit with a 600w,and 1kw light as well as a 2 or 4-bank Kinoflo with tungsten balanced tubes will probably get you started. You'll be able to get shots like the first image by using the 600w above and behind the model's head a bit and then using the kinoflo to fill in the front of the model. Then using the same principles you can just adjust the size of fixtures you're using to get the right amount of shadow required for the shot.

But looking at a few of the last pictures, you would probably need a stronger light to cast those long, strong shadows on the ground. I've never really worked with high powered fixtures so I can't really help there, but HMI would be the way to go but the price will start to raise pretty quickly.

Check out www.coollights.biz for some good and inexpensive fixtures. BH Photo Video also carries all of the Arri lighting packages.

And as Adrian stated, go to your control panel and change your name to your REAL first and last name.
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#5 Daniel Bestem

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Posted 11 April 2009 - 08:05 AM

Thanks for your help.!!

Can anyone tell me If will be able to achive such effects with 2 x 5K Tungsten fresnels with gel filters ? Or is there any other lighting set up you would recommend me ?

I am usually shooting with f/5.6 to f/8 with film balanced to daylight.
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#6 Martin Solvang

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 01:32 PM

Hey,
considering the depth of focus and the light level in the background (and the fact you like to shoot at about 5.6), I would generaly
say that bigger is better. When looking at the shadows though, one could say that a bigger lamp further back would
produce some of the same contrast in the subjects face. My experience with bigger lamps are that they are easier to control, soften, etc. The pics above are a little to color corrected for me to be certain about anything, but I believe that instead of using tungsten you would be better of with HMIs and CTS (warming gels) to get that little extra warmth that the sun sometimes produce..
Picture number 4 looks to me as if there is a flash somewhere in there also, and pretty close to the camera.

To try and answer your question, 2 x 5k is not a whole lot when competing with mother nature, but maybe this can help you..:

http://www.arri.de/l...calculator.html

This helped me alot in pre production..
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#7 Bob Hayes

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 02:28 PM

It’s hard to tell what your budget is. Movie lights are pretty expensive, $20,000 for a 6k HMI, as compared to still lighting. I am starting to see more use of movie lights on higher end still sets. Anything about a 1,200 HMI or a 2k Tungsten light will require a generator and a cable run. For balancing to daylight it is hard to beat Hmi’s. With regards to gelling tungsten the gels cut the light down considerably so you need bigger Tungsten lights for the same effect.

In your sample photos 1 and 5 looks like the key is Daylight and the fill is flash so you really only need a fill light here. It looks like they are doing some sort of dodging in post on these photos. On 2, 3, 4, and 6 they are shot on dark days so smaller lights as keys may be effective.
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#8 Christopher Arata

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 04:25 PM

Those photos have gone through some serious post, not just some simple dodging & burning. Also from the video, I'm pretty sure the photographer was shooting medium format, film, mostly likely as I did not see any digital backs or anything. Probably using a very slow stock, that would be one reason for using continuos light's of that size, and personal preference of the photographer. You could potentially do the same thing using some studio strobes with a lot less fuss. Anything from a 1200 Ws - 9600 Ws head & pack can easily over power daylight with out a problem. Chances are you would be shooting at an f8 or higher anyway, for sharpness & focus, that alone kills the ambient. Combine that with a shutter speed of 1/250 yea you pretty much don't need to use those lights unless you prefer continuous light over strobes and the extra hassle of the gear that goes with it.
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#9 Tom Jensen

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 04:31 PM

I do have to say I like the photos a lot.
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#10 Mei Lewis

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Posted 27 November 2009 - 04:06 PM

I like the photos too.

"Can any one tell me what kind of film lighting do I need to achive such effects ?"
It's not just what lights you use, but what the models look like, the maekup, the stylist, choice of location and of course how you use the lights and camera!
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