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Super 8 Telecine...


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#1 J. Anthony Gonzales

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 07:17 PM

Hi:

I am working on a project that will be shot on Super 8. This project is mostly geared towards internet consumption, with possible DVD availability. I have been talking with the guys at Spectra and this is the idea we came up with.

We are shooting at 18fps. What we are going to do is transfer at 30p and get a frame-by-frame scan, so we'll get all the frames. Then the plan is to slow the footage down in post using the NLE or After Effects or something in order to get it to play at the proper speed for the internet.


Has anybody done something like this? If so, how were the results?


John G.
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#2 Adam Garner

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 09:20 PM

I've transferred 18fps film at 24fps. That got all the frames, but I had to slow it down.

I ended up with, EITHER: 1, ghost frames (doubled up) or 2, dropped frames when using FCP. They both suck.

Doubled frames causes issues if you are editing scenes since you'll typically have a frame at the end of a take with the next take overlaid.

If you drop frames it tends to feel really really jerky.

Not sure what a 30p transfer offers different than a 24p. Does it alleviate this issue?
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#3 Robert Houllahan

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 10:14 PM

I've transferred 18fps film at 24fps. That got all the frames, but I had to slow it down.

I ended up with, EITHER: 1, ghost frames (doubled up) or 2, dropped frames when using FCP. They both suck.



This is because the telecine is applying a 2:3 pulldown to make the 24 fps film go into the 30fps video (technically 23.98fps to 59.97fields video) if you run the telecine at 30fps (29.97fps actually) each frame of the film will be on two fields of the video which will get you a clean frame for each film frame which you can speed change without any ghost frames.

2:3 pulldown puts the first frame on two fields and the next on three fields which gets you those blended frames you can do a reverse telecine in FCP cinema tools which will pull the blended frames out as well.

-Rob-
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#4 Will Montgomery

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Posted 13 April 2009 - 10:06 AM

We are shooting at 18fps. What we are going to do is transfer at 30p and get a frame-by-frame scan, so we'll get all the frames. Then the plan is to slow the footage down in post using the NLE or After Effects or something in order to get it to play at the proper speed for the internet.


Not quite sure of the advantage of this. When you slow it down withy a NLE you're going to be adding back in frames to "spread out" the footage back into normal time. A better bet would be to shoot at 24fps, transfer it back as SD 24p then keep that workflow throughout. Haven't done enough DVD authoring at different frame rates but perhaps its possible to write a video DVD at 24p. If not, you're back to interlaced footage anyway.
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#5 Freddy Van de Putte

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 01:29 AM

What we are going to do is transfer at 30p and get a frame-by-frame scan, so we'll get all the frames.


Hello John,

If you realy have a true (progressive) frame-by-frame scan, then this file will behave like the original film. So the only thing you must do is set the play speed. This is only a number in the header of the digital file. Set it to 18fps and it will play at 18fps, set it to 24fps and it will play at 24fps... that's it. This is what I have done on my Vimeo example files.

For AVI files, the most simple way to set play speed is with VirtualDub.

All this converting stuff is only needed for DVD use, not for computer use.

Fred.

Edited by Freddy Van de Putte, 14 April 2009 - 01:30 AM.

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Aerial Filmworks

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

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Wooden Camera

Ritter Battery

FJS International, LLC

rebotnix Technologies

Rig Wheels Passport

Metropolis Post

Willys Widgets

Abel Cine