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#1 Tim Carroll

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 03:53 PM

I've been following "cine lens set" auctions on eBay for the last few months now. And in that time Visual Products has had a number of auctions. The lenses look pretty nice, and Visual Products states:
NO RESERVE AUCTION
This is a great chance to get a great deal on a rare & unique lens set for your camera package

Then, when the auction doesn't go as high as Visual Products would like, they cancel the auction at the last minute and erase all the bids. I find that pretty offensive. If they want to put a reserve on an auction, fine, but don't advertise a NO RESERVE auction, and then close it at the last minute and cancel all the bids.

They currently have an auction for a set of Cooke Speed Panchro lenses in BNCR mount, listed as NO RESERVE like previously. This time they were including a Visual Products BNCR Mount for RED ONE with the auction, so if someone wins the auction they can use the lenses on their RED ONE.

Visual Products eBay Auction

The bidding has only gotten up to $3650 and suddenly the pictures of the Visual Products BNCR Mount for RED ONE mount have disappeared from the auction. They cleverly noted in the auction that "Not Included: Any item not pictured below" so they could get around the eBay restriction of not being able to remove something from a listing once a bid has been placed. So they just removed the pictures of the Visual Products BNCR Mount for RED ONE, and if they don't close the auction at the last minute like they have been doing, they can tell the winning bidder that he/she doesn't get the Visual Products BNCR Mount for RED ONE because it was no longer pictured in the auction.

Personally I think that really sucks.

Best,
-Tim
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#2 Stephen Williams

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 05:15 PM

Hi Tim,

I agree, I have asked VP to comment. BTW the RED mount is included acording to the wording of the ad.

Stephen
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#3 Tim Carroll

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 06:27 PM

Hi Tim,

I agree, I have asked VP to comment. BTW the RED mount is included acording to the wording of the ad.

Stephen


Stephen,

When the auction first went up there were pictures of the RED mount, like the ones below. They have now been removed from the auction and if you try to click on the marker where the pictures were, you get this message: "The page cannot be found" and it is a link to the Visual Products web site, so they are in control of whether the images are there or not.

Posted Image

Posted Image

I agree, the auction still talks about the RED mount being included, but it also states that "Not Included: Any item not pictured below" and now the RED mount is no longer pictured.


Best,
-Tim
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#4 Tim Carroll

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 08:10 PM

Well, it got up to $5100 and Visual Products didn't close the auction and cancel the bids, so hopefully someone got a nice set of Re-housed Cooke Speed Panchros in BNCR mount. If they have a RED camera I hope they will also get the "Visual Products BNCR Mount for RED ONE"

Best,
-Tim
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#5 Jim Hyslop

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 08:28 PM

Personally I think that really sucks.

Sounds like a bait-and-switch tactic - which is illegal in many countries.

File a complaint against them. I would consider their tactics fraudulent.
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#6 Visual Products

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 08:29 PM

Hello from Visual Products,

I assure you there is nothing nefarious going on here-- unless
you consider me being not so bright nefarious.

What can I say, it was not one of my better listings. First, after
spelling "panchro" correctly about twenty times in the listing, I
managed to spell it incorrectly in the title of the auction (if anyone
was searching for the illusive speed "pancho" lenses, they had
no problem finding them on ebay this week!). I caught the error
about two days into the auction, and I couldn't edit it because
there were bids placed. I decided to let the auction go because
I knew pulling the auction and relisting it would just look suspicious.
Then, to add insult to injury, I did some housecleaning on our
website and ended up deleting a folding without remembering that
it contained the photos of the BNCR mount for the speed panchro
lens auction (the lens pix were in a different folder). I didn't
catch that one until 8 minutes before the auction ended when
I checked the auction and saw Stephen's question. At that
point it was too late to fix.

Like I said, not one of my better auctions.

I can assure everyone that the winning bidder will get a VP BNCR mount
along with the lenses...(and I'll try to get more sleep or something before
I list anymore items on ebay).


Rick Benton
Sales
Visual Products, Inc.
rick@visualproducts.com
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#7 Richard Boddington

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 08:43 PM

Wow Tim you complained here and you actually got some attention!

Good for you.

R,
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#8 AmatEscalante

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 09:14 PM

Visual Products is a good and honest company that I have done business with many times in the past 10 years to complete satisfaction.

Amat
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#9 David Rakoczy

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 09:23 PM

I have not done business with VP, however, many many people have referred me to them... so, they must be doing (something) right as the folks who referred them are stand up people.
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#10 Tim Carroll

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 10:28 PM

I have never had a problem with buying gear from Visual Products. Everything I have received from them was just as described, and when it hasn't been, they have made good on it.

I'm not sure these eBay auctions are showing them off at their best.

Best,
-Tim
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#11 Adrian Sierkowski

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 11:28 PM

_______happens. I can vouch for VP. It's my primary purchase place for cine gear (when I get the money). Can't really fault them for a faulty e-bay auction. It's certainly a lot safer than going with a private bidder I would say.
Chalk this up to human error and move on-- though certainly Kudos on catching it so at least it won't happen again!
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#12 Dan Goulder

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Posted 17 April 2009 - 12:42 AM

The folks at Visual Products are as decent and honorable as anybody you'll ever do business with. I haven't the least bit of doubt that whatever slight you may have perceived was unintentional.
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#13 Paul Bruening

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Posted 17 April 2009 - 01:32 AM

They've been good eggs every time I've done business with them. It doesn't seem like them to do anything shady.
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#14 Jim Hyslop

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Posted 18 April 2009 - 11:16 AM

What with all the positive feedback on Visual Products, and the explanation from Mr. Benton, I hereby withdraw my suggestion of filing a complaint, and my allegations of underhanded tactics. My apologies to Visual Products.
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#15 David Rakoczy

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Posted 18 April 2009 - 01:22 PM

Very honest and stand up of you Jim!... maybe Tim should follow suit(?)...

Why post an accusatory post if all you had to do was call them first for an explanation???... after all, many have read the first post and have not followed this thread any further... and the damage has been done.. not good for VP at all... :(
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#16 Tim Carroll

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Posted 18 April 2009 - 03:50 PM

many have read the first post and have not followed this thread any further...


David,

Maybe you are guilty of the same. If you had read the entire thread you would have seen this post of mine:

"I have never had a problem with buying gear from Visual Products. Everything I have received from them was just as described, and when it hasn't been, they have made good on it.

I'm not sure these eBay auctions are showing them off at their best.

Best,
-Tim"


I do wish Rick had address the previous auction where Visual Products had canceled all the bids and removed the "cine lens set" just before the auction closed. Maybe that too was for a legitimate reason, but without an explanation it does not make Visual Products look good to the eBay community.

Best,
-Tim
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#17 David Rakoczy

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Posted 18 April 2009 - 05:05 PM

I saw it.. it was just way after the fact.... after many stood up for VP's reputation <_<
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#18 Tim Carroll

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Posted 18 April 2009 - 05:22 PM

I saw it.. it was just way after the fact.... after many stood up for VP's reputation <_<


Actually David, I posted that immediately after I had the opportunity to read Rick Benton's explanation for why he treated the auction exactly how I described.

Which happened to be less than two hours after Rick posted his explanation.

Maybe you spend 24 hours a day on this forum. I, unfortunately, am not afforded that luxury, as I actually have a life.



Was that smarmy enough? ;)

Best,
-Tim
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#19 Hal Smith

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Posted 18 April 2009 - 06:54 PM

The only way an eBay auction can be pulled down within the last twelve hours is if there are no bids. If there are any bids it can be pulled but must be sold to the current highest bidder. If there is a reserve the auction must be allowed to complete.

If a seller wants to end an auction before twelve hours to go they're free to cancel it or sell the item to the current highest bidder.

I've done some business with VP with satisfaction. I did buy one lens that I decided I didn't want after all and they took it back for full credit with no hassle. I've even done a little horsetrading with them, trading in a so-so O'Connor 50D that was missing some of the bolt on parts getting something I needed in return.

Their website isn't always up to date, a couple of my Speed Panchro II/III's came from them. I was asking them about something else and mentioned that I was looking for those lenses and they checked and had what I wanted and sold them for a fair price. It's always worth a phone call to them if your looking for something.
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#20 David Rakoczy

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Posted 18 April 2009 - 07:05 PM

Actually David, I posted that immediately after I had the opportunity to read Rick Benton's explanation for why he treated the auction exactly how I described.

Which happened to be less than two hours after Rick posted his explanation.

Maybe you spend 24 hours a day on this forum. I, unfortunately, am not afforded that luxury, as I actually have a life.



Was that smarmy enough? ;)

Best,
-Tim


Hey, no problem Tim. No need to be swarmy ;) ... I don't 'live' here either.

Have a great relaxing evening. (sincerely)
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