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Split diopter or Tilt Shift?


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#1 Jeremy M Lundborg

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 04:35 AM

I am gearing up for a shoot and I've a question about how to accomplish a specific shot:

A sniper's POV.

The camera will be the sniper who is aiming down the barrel of his gun (with a notch-sight at the nozzle). I'd love to keep the sight and the target (probably a hundred feet away) recognizable. I don't want to rack from one to the other to simply understand he is aiming, and I don't want to go too wide and loose the tension.
Any thoughts on the proper mechanism?

And what about a modern rifle? Can you focus easily on the optics in the sight while still making out the image?
This image looks altered, but you get the point.
Posted Image


We will be shooting with Master Primes.

Thank you.
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#2 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 09:12 AM

Stopping down the lens as much as possible is the only way -- split-diopters and tilt-focus lenses only work to hold one side of the image in focus, not hold an outer circle in focus around an inner circle.

Or doing it as a composite in post. But the truth is that the sight should be out-of-focus relative to the image inside of it.
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#3 Chris Keth

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 01:01 PM

Is it an open sight like you say in the post or a scope like the photo?

If it is open sights, David is bang on. You just can't focus two things stacked up in perspective like that other than working at a very deep stop. If you were shooting the rifleman in the foreground low in frame and the target in the distance, a tilt shift lens would allow you to get both in focus, but that isn't at all a POV of the shooter.

If it is a scope, you can basically focus on the shooter, with the scope on its lowest power, and you will have the target in focus as a focused aerial image produced by the scope. You would have better luck if you used a pistol scope because they have longer eye relief (focus the image further behind the scope) and the camera would see less portholing of the scoped image.
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#4 Dan Diaconu M

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 03:50 PM

Here is what I would try:
find a lens (acting as a diopter) and glue it centered on a UV filter on the camera lens. It should be roughly the diameter of the image you want to see (about 1/4???? of the filter??)

I know it takes some experimenting with different focal lengths but it provide you with just the shoot you need. You could also use it in combination with another lens (mimicking the scope)
You know better how much effort is worth the shoot.
Good luck anyway.
Dan Diaconu

Edited by Dan Diaconu M, 03 June 2009 - 03:53 PM.

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#5 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 03:52 PM

Is it an open sight like you say in the post or a scope like the photo?


Chris knows a lot about guns......

He's pretty good with focus, too.

;)
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#6 Chris Keth

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 04:36 PM

Chris knows a lot about guns......

He's pretty good with focus, too.

;)


Guilty, Sir. If I remember, though, you took a quick enjoyment to recreational firearms yourself. They were blanks, but that's not the point. ;)
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#7 Jeremy M Lundborg

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Posted 04 June 2009 - 02:27 AM

Thank you for all of your informative responses.

I can't wait to test.

Jeremy
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#8 Chris Keth

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Posted 04 June 2009 - 08:40 AM

Thank you for all of your informative responses.

I can't wait to test.

Jeremy


Testing that will be fun. I thought of another way you could do it that involves some prop making. Figure out the framing you want on the shooter and the focus distance that results. Then, figure out what value of minus diopter that will focus ~100 feet with the lens focused at the value you figured out for the shooter. Get a cheap small diameter minus diopter and cut it to fit in an empty prop scope.
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#9 Matt Garrett

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Posted 04 June 2009 - 02:17 PM

Posted Image

Recently shot through an old iraq scope with a close focusing zeiss standard speed.

One thing for sure is you will be losing a lot of light capturing the image through the scope.

Edited by Matt Garrett, 04 June 2009 - 02:18 PM.

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#10 Chris Keth

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Posted 04 June 2009 - 11:28 PM

Posted Image

Recently shot through an old iraq scope with a close focusing zeiss standard speed.

One thing for sure is you will be losing a lot of light capturing the image through the scope.


That's cool! I like that a lot. It's very much what you see when you look through a scope. You can see other stuff but it's very much blurred and in your periphery.
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