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#1 John Young

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Posted 23 July 2009 - 06:50 PM

Ok, Konvas or Mitchell?

I know, that's like two different worlds. The Konvas is cheaper, and that should sell me on it, but...

First, how can you tell if a Mitchell camera is 65mm or 35mm? I have seen several for sale on the internet, but I could never tell which was what.

I would like to shoot anamorphic. Well actually, I would like to shoot 2-perf, but with the cost of lenses vs. conversion, it seems the same (and I like anamorphic flares). The Konvas' are cheap, have cheap glass, and it seems like more and more of these things keep coming out of mother Russia.

If you were going to buy one camera, never do any hand held shots, always have the camera on some sort of mount (dolly, tripod head, whatever), and wanted to only shoot "scope" AR, which would use choose.

Thanks.
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#2 John Sprung

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Posted 23 July 2009 - 08:09 PM

I had a Konvas once, and have used Mitchells. I'd go Mitchell. It's far more solid, has pin registration, takes 1000 ft. loads.

They made very few 65mm cameras, if anyone is selling a 65, they'll certainly advertise it as such. The 35 models are the Standard, NC, BNC, and BNCR. The 65 was called BFC, three guesses what everybody said the letters stood for.



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#3 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 24 July 2009 - 04:59 AM

Ok, Konvas or Mitchell?

I know, that's like two different worlds. The Konvas is cheaper, and that should sell me on it, but...

First, how can you tell if a Mitchell camera is 65mm or 35mm? I have seen several for sale on the internet, but I could never tell which was what.

I would like to shoot anamorphic. Well actually, I would like to shoot 2-perf, but with the cost of lenses vs. conversion, it seems the same (and I like anamorphic flares). The Konvas' are cheap, have cheap glass, and it seems like more and more of these things keep coming out of mother Russia.

If you were going to buy one camera, never do any hand held shots, always have the camera on some sort of mount (dolly, tripod head, whatever), and wanted to only shoot "scope" AR, which would use choose.

Thanks.


Konvas and Mitchell, two difference class of 35 mm cine cameras.
Konvas - small size, low weight, hand-held 35 mm cine camera.
To have 400 ft and 200 ft film magazines, low weight crystal sync speed motor.
From otehr side, Konvas mechanism have one pin of claw mechnaism and have high value of noise.

Mitchell 35 mm ( NC, GS ) studio cameras, have big size and weight and 400 ft amd 1000 ft film magaiznes.
And, the mechanism of camera have transport and registration pins.
That's why, this is camera a more high class.
But, you must find of special battery, crystal sync speed, high power motor.


Konvas can have OST-19 ( Konvas-2M ) or OST-18 ( turret Konvas-1M ) lens mounts.
Konvas have of anamoprhic film gate, de-anamoprhic viewfinder, set of anamoprhic prime and zoom lenses.
And all this equipmnets will ask of less value of money.
Konvas spare parts, service available.
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#4 John Young

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Posted 24 July 2009 - 08:07 PM

Michell it is... Now to find one that is as cheap as a Konvas... :lol:
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#5 Rioux Pierre Samuel

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Posted 07 January 2010 - 05:17 PM

Hi
i have a Konvas 35mm M2, i could using it on a tripod i have for my auricon modified 16mm for news, btw the ceco shoulder pode made for the Auricon if you lower the base the Konvas fit on it.
Here a picture of my Konvas with a 200 ft mag 100 ft of film the chrystal motor the matt box and the plug to the battery and include a 50mm lens this weight is 17.5 pounds.

I will try to upload a picture..

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#6 Bruce Taylor

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Posted 09 January 2010 - 08:46 PM

Michell it is... Now to find one that is as cheap as a Konvas... :lol:


You really need to know what it is you want to shoot. The Konvas is an MOS camera, small and light, the Mitchell is a studio camera. It's easy to haul a Konvas to remote areas and mount it on lightweight supports or hand hold it. The Mitchell weighs a ton and is made for a studio environment where it works perfectly. One won't do the work of the other very well. Visual Products was selling some old BNCRs at a good price last time I looked.


Bruce Taylor
www.indi35.com
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#7 Paul Bruening

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Posted 09 January 2010 - 10:22 PM

Hello John,

Have you decided on 2-perf or not? There are conversion kits still floating around for Mitchell NCs. Konvas are pricey to convert to 2-perf. If you're going to stay in 4-perf I'd recommend Konvas. Either one will have to be blimped for sound.

I've got Mitchells and love them. But, if I could start all over, I'd probably go with Konvas.
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#8 Adrian Sierkowski

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Posted 09 January 2010 - 10:54 PM

Despite eating fuses like Tic-Tacs sometimes, I love my 2m Konvas primarily because it is small and light. I also have a barney which kills it down enough to record audio with it in interior spaces, granted the noise is still there but it's manageable.
Now, if you have all the support for the Mitchells, certainly go for one.. and no one says you can't have both (in time). I'd recommend starting on the Konvas, though.
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#9 Rioux Pierre Samuel

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Posted 11 January 2010 - 08:27 PM

Hi Olex and Bruce
Well i know you i am from the Konvas forum

Adrian I have also a soft blimp but never using it, i
used my konvas to do some nice scene i including in my digital hd film documentary.
My blimp was made by the same how do mag blimp for Panavision in USA
I got a chance to buy it for 135 $ and i jump on it.

Presently i try to adapting a Tameron zoom 50 to 150mm to OCT 19
using different macro ring from Pentacon six
a inverter screw 62 or 63mm to pentacon Six
and i will finish with a pentacon to Oct 19 sold by Kiev Camera in USA
The Tameron zoom is the size and weight of a 200 mm prime Lomo but
the Tameron is made for still for military 2 1/4 x 2 1/4 used and it's more a variable zoom lens then a real zoom.

The picture is a Century 500mm i have on my Bolex in 76 when i go in Africa, i remove the 16mm reducer and bring back the lens for 35mm movie and put a oct 19 mount on it. Finding the infinity is not easy but possible. This wy i try again with a zoom... i long time looking to find a zoom... the 25mm to 250mm are very long and heavy and the small 37 to 140 they are not so good except if the lens is mint... but it's harder to find good lomo lens now. To many seller transfer them to PL mount.

The Russian Konvas jump in price and i am looking now on ARRI stuff specially for lens.
I have a adapter to using Pentacon six lens to the Konvas. My LOMO lens kit is 18mm, 22mm,35mm,50mm.75mm,200mm.

I think the Konvas M2 is the best camera the Russian made.

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#10 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 12 January 2010 - 03:50 AM

I think the Konvas M2 is the best camera the Russian made.


Thank.
I agree, Konvas-2M is the best russian hand held camera.
I can compare of Konvas-2M with best russian tank T-34 at time of World War II, to simply and to reliable.

About me, the top of zoom lens design - 35OPF-21-1 25-500mm F3.5/ T4.5
You can imagine zoom lens with diameter 260 mm, length 500 mm and weight 17 kg.

About Telelenses :
upgraded photo MTO-1000mm lens, mirror ( Maksutov) optical scheme, fixed aperture.
OKS-2-1000 mm lens have main lens 500 mm F3.2 and 2x rear converter 1000mm F6.3
OKS-4-1000 mm F11 ( 500 mm with 2x converter )
OKS-5-1000 mm F6.3

Pentacon-6 photo lenses had 2x tele converter too.
If you have P6-OST-19 lens munt adapter, you can use Carl Zeiss 600 mm lens of Pentacon Six.
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#11 Rioux Pierre Samuel

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Posted 17 January 2010 - 02:02 PM

Thank.
I agree, Konvas-2M is the best russian hand held camera.
I can compare of Konvas-2M with best russian tank T-34 at time of World War II, to simply and to reliable.

About me, the top of zoom lens design - 35OPF-21-1 25-500mm F3.5/ T4.5
You can imagine zoom lens with diameter 260 mm, length 500 mm and weight 17 kg.

About Telelenses :
upgraded photo MTO-1000mm lens, mirror ( Maksutov) optical scheme, fixed aperture.
OKS-2-1000 mm lens have main lens 500 mm F3.2 and 2x rear converter 1000mm F6.3
OKS-4-1000 mm F11 ( 500 mm with 2x converter )
OKS-5-1000 mm F6.3

Pentacon-6 photo lenses had 2x tele converter too.
If you have P6-OST-19 lens munt adapter, you can use Carl Zeiss 600 mm lens of Pentacon Six.



HI OLEX

I see you said OST-19 and i said OCT 19 so i like ta know if the term i using for the same mount is ok.
BTW interesting the Pentacon six Lens i like to using them on my Konvas Now i have the adapter mount Pentacon six to OCT 19.
Btw the 2x converter from Pentacon Six a used one how i should to expect to pay ? this is just to give me a idea.
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#12 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 18 January 2010 - 04:20 AM

HI OLEX

I see you said OST-19 and i said OCT 19 so i like ta know if the term i using for the same mount is ok.
BTW interesting the Pentacon six Lens i like to using them on my Konvas Now i have the adapter mount Pentacon six to OCT 19.
Btw the 2x converter from Pentacon Six a used one how i should to expect to pay ? this is just to give me a idea.


OST-19 and OCT-19 a two different version of translation of one name of russian industrial standard of lens mounts. At russian letters, the name of standard show like OCT-19-144-83.
That's why the words OCT-19 and OST-19 call one russian industrial standard.
About 2x converters with P6 ( Kiev-60 ) lens mount, this can be original Carl Zeiss or Ukrainian converter with Kiev-60 lens mount ( similar lens mount of Pentacon-Six).
To find on ebay.
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#13 K Borowski

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Posted 18 January 2010 - 12:40 PM

Russian uses a cyrillic alphabet, with some letters more similar to Greek than Roman alphabets.

"C" is the cyrillic "s" "P" is the cyrillic "r" the Russian "b" looks like the number 6, among others. Sorry, I don't have the character set to do it justice.

I've seen some pretty funny attempts at translating Russian into romanized characters, including on a barcode label for a Russian hockey stick where someone had just changed the letters into the closest-looking English equivalents, kind of like in the movie "Borat" where they use the backwards R (Russian character for the "ya" sound) instead of R.


Here is a link to a wikipedia article I found with a quick search: http://en.wikipedia....ussian_alphabet

Edited by Karl Borowski, 18 January 2010 - 12:43 PM.

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#14 Rioux Pierre Samuel

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Posted 22 January 2010 - 02:11 AM

OST-19 and OCT-19 a two different version of translation of one name of russian industrial standard of lens mounts. At russian letters, the name of standard show like OCT-19-144-83.
That's why the words OCT-19 and OST-19 call one russian industrial standard.
About 2x converters with P6 ( Kiev-60 ) lens mount, this can be original Carl Zeiss or Ukrainian converter with Kiev-60 lens mount ( similar lens mount of Pentacon-Six).
To find on ebay.




Hi Olex

I just find a x4
Teleconcertor 4x for Pentacon six Kiev it's look to be rare so like i said i jump on it.
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#15 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 22 January 2010 - 07:16 AM

Hi Olex
I just find a x4
Teleconcertor 4x for Pentacon six Kiev it's look to be rare so like i said i jump on it.


You sure, what this is optical tele-converter 4x ? and will transfer 80 mm lens on 320 mm ?

May be, this is multi-image-transformer ? on four dimilar images at one picture ?
I know a similar transofmers 4x, 6x, 8x.
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#16 Rioux Pierre Samuel

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Posted 23 January 2010 - 12:29 AM

You sure, what this is optical tele-converter 4x ? and will transfer 80 mm lens on 320 mm ?

May be, this is multi-image-transformer ? on four dimilar images at one picture ?
I know a similar transofmers 4x, 6x, 8x.




Hi OLEX here the link if it's still available
http://cgi.ebay.com/...e=STRK:MEWAX:IT

the seller said very close to 4 ?
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#17 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 23 January 2010 - 04:02 AM

Hi OLEX here the link if it's still available
http://cgi.ebay.com/...e=STRK:MEWAX:IT

the seller said very close to 4 ?


As for me, strange.
Yes, this is device show like rear tele lens adapter.
But, as of my knowledge :
2x teleconverter have complex optical system, consist from a few glass components.
2x teleconverter for 35 mm SLR photo cameras have optical system diameter near 20 and length 20..30 mm.
2x teleconverter of medium format photo camera must have mor big size.
But, at image of 4x converter, i see of thin glass.

Any case, the point of this doubt can set of real test of 4x converter with lens and camera.

From other side, If the 2x converter cut of 1 stop of lens speed, 4x must cut of 2 stops and more.
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#18 Rioux Pierre Samuel

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Posted 23 January 2010 - 12:58 PM

As for me, strange.
Yes, this is device show like rear tele lens adapter.
But, as of my knowledge :
2x teleconverter have complex optical system, consist from a few glass components.
2x teleconverter for 35 mm SLR photo cameras have optical system diameter near 20 and length 20..30 mm.
2x teleconverter of medium format photo camera must have mor big size.
But, at image of 4x converter, i see of thin glass.

Any case, the point of this doubt can set of real test of 4x converter with lens and camera.

From other side, If the 2x converter cut of 1 stop of lens speed, 4x must cut of 2 stops and more.



Hi Olex
Yes i admit it's look fro me also for a rear glass element.... we will see

Exa, Exakta are they similar to Pentacon six mount ?

BTW (by the way ) I lost the link to your very nice website on Russian Camera Olex on the geocity server do you have a new link... Steven Lyle The Canadian in Korea tel me you made a great job on is Kinor 16mm.
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#19 Rioux Pierre Samuel

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Posted 28 January 2010 - 08:31 AM

Hi Olex
Yes i admit it's look fro me also for a rear glass element.... we will see

Exa, Exakta are they similar to Pentacon six mount ?

BTW (by the way ) I lost the link to your very nice website on Russian Camera Olex on the geocity server do you have a new link... Steven Lyle The Canadian in Korea tel me you made a great job on is Kinor 16mm.



BACK TO KONVAS vs MITCHEL

For me KONVAS M2 , ARRI 2 abc, Eclair CM3 are more flexible if you using like a B camera.

a Mitchel the Kinnor 35 are heavy camera and need every ting how go with larger camera.
Mitchel could be considered if you do studio work like animation stuff and title.

BTW i just get my Pentacon six 4x teleconverter a great single glass like for the 2 x.
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#20 Olex Kalynychenko

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Posted 01 February 2010 - 03:35 AM

Exa, Exakta are they similar to Pentacon six mount ?

Sorry, not.

BTW (by the way ) I lost the link to your very nice website on Russian Camera Olex on the geocity server do you have a new link..

New links at development now.
You can visit http://sites.google....serviceskonvas/
The technical library Webs will late.
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