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Photographer shooting 8mm film for first time...


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#1 Matthew Oaten

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Posted 05 August 2009 - 05:16 AM

Hi,

I'm a photographer (film and digital) fairly experienced in the world of video, but unfortunately not motion film (somehow managed to escape me!)

I am shooting a tableau vivant film for a royal college of art postgrad student, and I just wanted to know if there are any extra considerations that you guys would recommend I take into account (I know there will be tons).

I have purchased a Beaulieu 4009 ZM4, with schneider 1.4 6-70mm lens. Tested, and in working order. The artist has already purchased the film, 7 rolls of kodak vision 3 500t colour negative film to shoot with.

Some scenes will be outdoor, some will be inside a disused rail station, with gaping holes in the roof. We have a generator and lights, so is it best to stick some blue gels on the lights and film as if daylight?

I have a manual for the ZM4, but the lens I have has a filter feature not indicated anywhere in this. It has a little daylight/tungsten filter wheel situated next to the zoom limiter switch. When set to daylight its very horribly orange/sepia through the viewfinder, and far more natural looking when set to the tungsten setting (outside on a cloudy day). Which setting should I use?

Is it best to measure focus, or just open the aperture, zoom in and focus this way?

Any tips or advice will be most welcome. I have spent a lot of time on these forums and learnt a hell of a lot already, so thanks to those of you who have got me this far....!

Matt Oaten
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#2 Kent Kumpula

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Posted 05 August 2009 - 07:23 AM

...some will be inside a disused rail station, with gaping holes in the roof. We have a generator and lights, so is it best to stick some blue gels on the lights and film as if daylight?


Yes, you don´t want mixed light. Makes it almost impossible to get the colors right... (depends on the level of mixed light).

I have a manual for the ZM4, but the lens I have has a filter feature not indicated anywhere in this. It has a little daylight/tungsten filter wheel situated next to the zoom limiter switch. When set to daylight its very horribly orange/sepia through the viewfinder, and far more natural looking when set to the tungsten setting (outside on a cloudy day). Which setting should I use?


Are you using the original lens? It sounds as if your lens has a daylight filter. Your camera should have one too, make sure you only use one of them.

Yes, you should activate the daylight filter when shooting tungsten balanced films in daylight. 500T is a T-ungsten balanced film.

Is it best to measure focus, or just open the aperture, zoom in and focus this way?


Measuring would be better, but zooming in would be faster. Use whatever fits the shooting. If possible I would measure, just to be sure.
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#3 Matthew Oaten

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Posted 05 August 2009 - 08:07 AM

Yes, it is the original lens. It is identical to the one in the manual, aside from the lens filter option being present.

Yes, my lens has two options, either daylight (a symbol of the sun) or tungsten (a lightbulb symbol). It looks to me that the camera's filter has been de-activated/removed as the place you are supposed to insert a key to activate/deactivate it has been blocked, and no key came with the camera.

So the daylight filter, which gives me an distinct orangey look, should be engaged when shooting outside. I'm just a little worried/confused (and this is probably due to my lack of Film experience) as through the lens, the image looks a lot nicer and realistic when the tungsten filter (blue) is engaged. I guess i'm used to seeing what I see through the lens being the end result!

Apologies for my own confusion,

Matt
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#4 Kent Kumpula

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Posted 05 August 2009 - 08:34 AM

When shooting with tungsten balanced film in tungsten light, don´t use any filter.
When shooting with tungsten balanced film in daylight, use the orange filter (daylight filter).

When shooting with daylight balanced film in daylight, don´t use any filter.
When shooting with daylight balanced film in tungsten light, use the blue filter (tungsten filter).
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#5 Matthew Oaten

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Posted 05 August 2009 - 08:40 AM

When shooting with tungsten balanced film in tungsten light, don´t use any filter.
When shooting with tungsten balanced film in daylight, use the orange filter (daylight filter).

When shooting with daylight balanced film in daylight, don´t use any filter.
When shooting with daylight balanced film in tungsten light, use the blue filter (tungsten filter).


Thats what i needed to hear, loud and simple. Thanks!
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#6 andy oliver

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Posted 05 August 2009 - 05:38 PM

Hi, 6-70 came with or without the inbuilt filter. Remove the lens from the camera, run the camera, then disconnect the power supply while keeping the trigger depressed. Hopefully the mirror shutter may stay open, try a couple of times until mirror shutter is out of optical path for you to look into cameras gate to see if the camera has an in built wratten filter. It maybe possible the previous owner bolted on the 6-70 obtained from another camera. I've owned a ZM4, but i just cannot recall whether the camera or lens had the filter. The last thing you want to do is shoot film through two 85 filters!!! I'm sure the 6-70s with filters were supplied on the 6008/7008s as these cameras did not have in built filters... Hope i've made some kind of sense.
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#7 Kent Kumpula

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Posted 05 August 2009 - 07:02 PM

I have purchased a Beaulieu 4009 ZM4, with schneider 1.4 6-70mm lens. Tested, and in working order.


Did you use any filters when you shot your test?
Or did you buy the camera from a seller who says it is "tested and working"?

If you haven´t exposed a single reel with the camera yet... Perhaps a testcartridge would be a good idea before shooting something important?
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#8 Matthew Oaten

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Posted 07 August 2009 - 04:24 AM

Hi, 6-70 came with or without the inbuilt filter. Remove the lens from the camera, run the camera, then disconnect the power supply while keeping the trigger depressed. Hopefully the mirror shutter may stay open, try a couple of times until mirror shutter is out of optical path for you to look into cameras gate to see if the camera has an in built wratten filter. It maybe possible the previous owner bolted on the 6-70 obtained from another camera. I've owned a ZM4, but i just cannot recall whether the camera or lens had the filter. The last thing you want to do is shoot film through two 85 filters!!! I'm sure the 6-70s with filters were supplied on the 6008/7008s as these cameras did not have in built filters... Hope i've made some kind of sense.


Andy, thank you for this! When the gate is open, i can see straight through to where the film is going to be exposed, no filter is present :) !

The camera was sold as tested and working by the seller. He has sells a LOT of super 8 camera's and has positive on all of them, so I was making a trusted purchase. Although I completely agree with you, unfortunately I don't think i'll have to time to run a test reel and get it developed by next weekend.... but i feel more confident now after the above test. Do you think it's worth exposing a reel just to check its running the film ok?

Thanks guys,


Matt
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#9 Kent Kumpula

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Posted 07 August 2009 - 02:25 PM

The camera was sold as tested and working by the seller.... Do you think it's worth exposing a reel just to check its running the film ok?


Well it depends on what you are shooting. If it is something important then it is always worth it to shoot one cart just to make sure. But if there is no time to do this then it is not an option anyway.
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