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final cut/cinema tools questions


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#1 petersant

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Posted 31 March 2010 - 02:36 AM

Hey all,
I have just shot and tk'd a new film and have a few questions before I start editing. I am being careful as I will finish on 16mm film with optical sound.so here is what I've done so far.

Shot on standard 16mm at 24 fps (no sync sound needed)

telecined the footage to dvcam at 25fps

telecine includes burnt in timecode and keycode

telecine also with flexfile (camera roll only not slate/take)



My first question is after I input the flexfiles to cinema tools and do a batch capture in fcp should I conform the footage in cinema tools to 24fps?

Also since I have done a batch capture in fcp (camera rolls) for ease of editing should I divide each batch/camera roll into sub-clips in order to have easy access to each shot?
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#2 Saul Rodgar

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Posted 31 March 2010 - 03:02 AM

My understanding is that you first capture your source material (creating sub clips if need be), then do a Reverse Telecine (3:2 pull down) in Cinema Tools and then create your new database with your flex files in Cinema Tools. At least that is how I have done it and how this following (older) link also describes it:

http://www.editorsgu...nema_tools.html
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#3 petersant

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Posted 31 March 2010 - 03:32 AM

As far as I understand there is no need for a reverse telecine as it was tk'd at 25fps, i.e there is no drop frames, i.e not 29.???

Is this correct?
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#4 Saul Rodgar

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Posted 31 March 2010 - 04:09 AM

Yes, you are right. Sorry, I am in a NTSC country, and I am so used to doing it that way that I just brain farted. You should be able to conform to 24 fps. However there are some potential TC issues. Dunno what you version of FCP you have, this comes from the FCP 7 manual:

About 24 @ 25 Timecode

Conforming 25 fps video to 24 fps does not alter the 25 fps timecode of your PAL footage, so this command creates an unusual media format in which the video rate is 24 fps (the original rate of the film) and the timecode rate is 25 fps (the original timecode numbers from your PAL videotape). When you conform 25 fps media files to 24 fps, the media file timecode rate is defined as 24 @ 25. You can verify the timecode rate for a clip in the TC Rate Browser column or in the Item Properties window.

24 @ 25 timecode makes it easy to work at 24 fps but retain 25 fps timecode throughout your edit. You can then export a 25 fps EDL that matches your PAL video footage and therefore can be matched by a negative cutter to the original film edge code.

Note: Because the editing timebase and playback are based on 24 fps, the 25 fps timecode no longer accurately represents the true passage of time. For example, 38 seconds of video (as defined by its 25 fps-based timecode) will actually take 40 seconds to play.
Creating 24 @ 25 Sequences and Easy Setups

To properly edit 24 @ 25 clips, you need to create a sequence with an editing timebase of 24 fps and set the timecode rate of this sequence to the special 24 @ 25 option. This option displays 25 fps timecode in your sequence as though you were editing PAL video, but the sequence plays back at 24 fps.

There are two sequence presets designed for 24 fps PAL video:

*
DV PAL 48 kHz - 24 @ 25: This preset uses a 24 fps editing timebase and 25 fps timecode. When you export an EDL from a sequence with this sequence preset, 25 fps timecode values are used. This method is more common and should be used when you intend to export a 25 fps EDL for the negative cutter, instead of a cut list.
*
DV PAL 48 kHz - 2: This preset does not support 24 @ 25 editing. Instead, both the editing timebase and the sequence timecode are 24 fps. This method should only be used when you intend to export a cut list from your 24 fps PAL project.

You can use the DV PAL 24 @ 25 Easy Setup included with Final Cut Pro, or you can create your own 24 @ 25 sequence preset if you are working with a format other than DV.
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#5 petersant

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Posted 31 March 2010 - 06:01 AM

O,k so I guess it's best I conform to 24fps in Cinema tools and Create an Easy set up in FCP at DV PAL 24@25.

But I also have the Flexfiles which contain the key code (as well as burnt in keycode and timecode) will this cause any conflicts? I guess the keycode is a more solid method as it is embedded in the film.

P.S sorry about this it is the first time I have finished on film and must get it right now to avoid any problems later down the line.
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#6 Richard Boddington

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Posted 31 March 2010 - 04:29 PM

Too bad you had to go to tape. I cut my last show in FCP using true 24fps QT files made by the lab of every shot.

The final EDL was a perfect conform back to the TC on the HDSR masters.

Will you actually be cutting the 16mm neg using your FCP EDL?

Or are you going back to tape and doing an auto assembly with your FCP EDL?

R,
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#7 petersant

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Posted 31 March 2010 - 06:20 PM

Yes I will be cutting the neg form an EDL and a cut list from FCP.

Also will making subclips from the batch capture disrupt anything?
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