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Finaly testing the KINOR 35H


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#1 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 03 June 2010 - 10:05 AM

finaly I have put together what I need to shoot anamorphic with the KINOR 35H.
The camera seems to work fine, but although I like the sound of the camera, it seems to me hardly possible to shoot sound with it (even outdoors).
I will have to build a very efficient barney for the camera if I want avoid troubles with the sound guy.
Once I get the test developed I will post the footage on vimeo.


daniel
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#2 James Compton

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Posted 03 June 2010 - 12:09 PM

finaly I have put together what I need to shoot anamorphic with the KINOR 35H.
The camera seems to work fine, but although I like the sound of the camera, it seems to me hardly possible to shoot sound with it (even outdoors).
I will have to build a very efficient barney for the camera if I want avoid troubles with the sound guy.
Once I get the test developed I will post the footage on vimeo.


daniel




Daniel,

The camera may be louder than normal because it needs grease and oil. Have you had your camera serviced by a professional technician?
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#3 Adrian Sierkowski

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Posted 03 June 2010 - 12:39 PM

I'd say send it out for a CLA as well, those cameras should be quiet enough for audio work... Hell I did sync on my 2m..... Wasn't perfect but certainly doable even indoors.
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#4 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 03 June 2010 - 01:59 PM

The camera has ben lubed by a camtech just before I bought it, I opened it, and it appears to be very clean, and also greased.
Actually I don't know what a CLA is?
I also recently had modified the registration pin for B&H perforation and the Job in my opinion has been done very well (the noise is more or less the same when running with or without film loaded).
To me the camera sounds healthy like a good running sewingmashine, but it's much louder than my AATON LTR7 (it is supposed to be, but I did not expect that it would be that much).
On the other hand, I have newer worked with a sync sound capable 35mm before, so maybe I just expected to much...
The Sound Guy I worked with using my AATON already hated the AATON when shooting inside...

thanks
Daniel
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#5 Adrian Sierkowski

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Posted 03 June 2010 - 02:09 PM

CLA: Clean Lubricate Adjust.

Some of them are noisy... though honestly an LTR-7 isn't that loud so if the sound guy is complaining about it causing audio problems... well needless to say thousands of films have been shot on LTR7s and your 35H sync without issue...
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#6 Bruce Taylor

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Posted 03 June 2010 - 02:52 PM

well needless to say thousands of films have been shot on LTR7s and your 35H sync without issue...



True enough, Adrian!

Hey Daniel, it's nice to see you're running some film through your Kinor. Kinors are not the quietest cameras, but they are managable. It should be relatively quiet after the B&H perf issue was resolved, but even their spec sheet rates them at 32db for noise, so they aren't the quietest sync cameras (though few clients have complained about noise except in small, live rooms-- that's why I send my sound barney out on rentals).

Your camera is essentially new (used on one production I think) and just serviced ("CLA'd") by Richard at Cinema Engineering before being shipped to you, so it should be running perfectly. Rather than making your own barney you might contact Lee Gaither at http://www.customuph...ryproducts.com/ .
He makes barneys for all the big players (Arri, Panavision) and he already has a template for your Kinor. His materials are much better than anything I could come up with, plus he's a nice guy and his prices are very reasonable.

Good luck and have fun!
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#7 James Steven Beverly

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Posted 05 June 2010 - 02:12 AM

Hell I did sync on my 2m..... Wasn't perfect but certainly doable even indoors.

I'm impressed!!! :) One other thing that makes noise are the Mags, THAT maybe part of your problem. Olex is quieting down my PII mags. They account for a lot of the noise, but these cameras are NEVER going to be as quiet as newer western sync cameras, they also don't cost 1 /10th what a modern western camera costs so just learn to live with their minor short comings, the savings more than make up for them. I mean you have a complete anamorphic package for what a SINGLE modern western anamorphic lens costs. Hell Rodriguez shot El Mariachi on a 16mm wild camera for Christ's sake. IF you can't. rent a Panavision, BUT for a feature, it'll cost you what your entire package cost. :rolleyes:

Edited by James Steven Beverly, 05 June 2010 - 02:14 AM.

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#8 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 08 June 2010 - 11:42 AM

Infact the mags are a bit noisy especially the big ones, and probably the noise will increase if I really load 1000ft of film instead of 400ft, like I did for the test.
But the 400ft mags are not that noisy at all, so they might be the choice for interior shooting. I am also looking to get a blimp like the ones Bruce mentioned.
The mags are also built in a way that seems a bit weired to me, the big plasticdiscs inside produce some noise, but this should not be to difficult to fix once everything else prooves to be fine.
Also the iron stiks on the cover of the mags are for some reason deeper in the cover than the metal plate, and so the film will touch the metalplate and generate a scraping sound. To my opinion the metalstiks are actually there to prevent exactly this, but like they are now they can't do the job. Tis is the same on all my mags and must be a productionmistake, maybe the metalcover was added at a later point of designing the mags...

And then hopefully shooting will start, actually we already planned to shoot in april, but due to screenplayproblems the project keeps shifting, but it will be shot this year.
Just a 10min. teaser shortfilm for a feature project but finally on 35mm :-)

daniel
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#9 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 05 July 2010 - 10:28 AM

finaly the processed and telecined material has come back, you can see the test at
Everything seems ok, but fokusing trough the viewfinder gives a 20-30cm difference compared to metering (at 2m distance from the object). In the Test (I did not put online the test with the fokus charts) the fokus appears to be sharper if made with the meter, so probably the flange of the groundlass is slightly off.

Daniel
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#10 daniel mahlknecht

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Posted 05 July 2010 - 10:42 AM

by the way, does anybody know how this deanamorphic viewefinder converter works with the Kinor 35H?
http://cgi.ebay.de/D...=item43a0293754
I have bought it but I can not find out how it should be used, actually id doesn't seem to belonge to the KINOR 35H at all...
The seller couldn't help either, so I had decided to risc and try.

thanks
Daniel
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#11 Brian Rose

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Posted 05 July 2010 - 12:03 PM

Wow that was a pleasure to see your footage. It instantly made me recall my own pleasure at viewing my first 16mm test footage. I'm firmly on the fence when it comes to Film or Digital, but I will say, there is nothing like the pleasure of seeing a film daily you shot.

BR
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#12 XiaoSu Han

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Posted 05 July 2010 - 04:47 PM

die analoge widerstandsfront! awesome, saw a rolleiflex too :)

ps: join the mailing list at konvas.org, good resource if you should have more questions about kinor etc.

cheers
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#13 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 05 July 2010 - 06:57 PM

I honestly don't mean to be cutting, but yeah, that's the sort of quality you can get when all the advanced technology is in the consumables and it costs you $1000 every time you get it out of the case :)
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#14 John Young

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Posted 05 July 2010 - 11:26 PM

Well I think it's absolutely fantastic and I want one.
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