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16mm Telecine and Grain


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#1 Bill DiPietra

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Posted 29 June 2010 - 10:49 AM

Hey all.

I'm about to get a 16mm film telecined and have been planning on a 2K scan all along. However, I am reconsidering that. Cost is not a big factor, but grain is. I don't want the image to look too clean (something I always see with 35mm scanned prints.) I still want to see grain.

For those of you with experience in telecine, can anyone tell me if I will still see some grain in the 2K scanned image? I shot this on Kodak 7231 which is pretty fine-grained as it is. Basically, I want the video image to still look like film.

Thanks for any input.

Edited by Bill DiPietra, 29 June 2010 - 10:50 AM.

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#2 Chris Durham

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Posted 29 June 2010 - 11:16 AM

Are you planning a telecine or a frame-by-frame scan? If you're doing a scan to a 2k dpx sequence your grain should be apparent. I've seen 1080 scans of 8mm and 2k scans of 16mm where the grain was pretty obvious.
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#3 Tom Hepburn

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Posted 29 June 2010 - 12:43 PM

Hi Bill,

I've got some full frames (1920 x 1080) of 7231 that I can post later if you're interested. "grainy" can be kind of subjective, but you can decide for yourself. In fact I may have a couple different stills, one done on an Arriscan and one with a spirit. Let me know if you're interested.

Tom
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#4 Bill DiPietra

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Posted 29 June 2010 - 05:22 PM

Hi Bill,

I've got some full frames (1920 x 1080) of 7231 that I can post later if you're interested. "grainy" can be kind of subjective, but you can decide for yourself. In fact I may have a couple different stills, one done on an Arriscan and one with a spirit. Let me know if you're interested.

Tom


Thanks, Tom. Feel free to post those. I'd like to see them.

Yes, I was planning a 2K scan to DPX file. Thanks guys.
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#5 Robert Houllahan

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Posted 30 June 2010 - 12:59 PM

Thanks, Tom. Feel free to post those. I'd like to see them.

Yes, I was planning a 2K scan to DPX file. Thanks guys.



If you scan to log on a Arriscan or a northlight, etc which resolution oversample the frame, i.e. the arriscan scans in 3k and down samples to 2K, the grain should be resolved nicely. An original spirit-1 in log data mode does not oversample for 2k it actually undersamples at 1920 lines for Y and 1/2 that for rgb which in my opinion makes the grain a bit chunky and that is usually suppressed with the dvnr box making the scan over clean.

-Rob-
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#6 Elliot Rudmann

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Posted 01 July 2010 - 10:12 AM

When you scan into smaller format film (8mm, 16mm) with deeper resolutions the first thing most people notice is that the grain becomes more pronounced, however more detail is resolved and the image is sharper. If the grain does not bother you and you want greater image resolution (resolution in terms of picture quality, not just pixel quantity), a 2k scan is definitely more suitable than any HD spirit transfer with noise reduction (dvnr) added. Good luck!
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