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Digital front projection advice


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#1 Tony Brown

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 09:06 AM

I have a scene to shoot car interior day

The car (a Hummer enlarged x 1.5) will be a mock up in the studio

Production want to project the BG plates on to screens using digital projectors with 3300 lumens. As the screen area required is an unknown, I'm seeking advice on a more powerful system. there will also be ambient light scatter from the lamps lighting the car interior (from outside)which will knock the screen level down to......zero probably

Any suggestions please




And please dont anybody say blue/green screen.......
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#2 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 09:24 AM

What sort of projectors?

DLPs have somewhat better, um, kerpow per lumen because of the improved contrast performance.

P
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#3 Tony Brown

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 09:31 AM

Hi Phil.

This is all pretty rhetorical as until we find the set ups I have no idea if the screen area needs to be 15x8 or 30x20 or 8x6. The easy way is to blue screen it and drop in the plates but I'm investigating their proposal....

This is the suggested unit, but with a suggested screen max of 8x6 (no doubt in ideal, subdued light conditions) I've no doubt we'll be ******* in the ocean

http://www.eventproj...duct=Sanyo-XP41

Though this looks more like it..... http://www.eventproj...-Roadster-HD18K
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#4 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 11:14 AM

Most manufacturers get their screen size estimations from the Department of Wishful Thinking in any case, so I suspect you may need to downrate things a little even then.

Still, I'm told (but don't know) that the mighty Similo used video back projection to great effect, so it can clearly be done even if you do end up using a screen the size of the takeboard in order to get the brightness up enough. How you shoot the plates will of course be influenced by these sorts of factors so I guess it's as well to be thinking about it well ahead of time.

P
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#5 John Sprung

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 12:56 PM

The easy way is to blue screen it and drop in the plates but I'm investigating their proposal....


Blue or green screen is overwhelmingly a better idea. Projection is what was done 80 years ago, because it was the only thing they had other than big glass mattes. It's an antique.

Time is money everywhere, it's just that the exchange rate varies. There's a meta-principle that complexity should be moved away from where time is expensive to where it's less expensive. So, moving compositing to post is the right idea. With front projection, you're stuck with its light levels that you have to match, and you get one chance during production to get the colors of the real and projected images to match. In post, you can reposition and color correct all you want, and in a comfortable facility. It's not just the easy way, it's the high quality way to go. It'll also be a lot less expensive, since you'll save hours on the set tweaking it. And even then, you'll be stuck with whatever you get if you can't tweak it far enough.

About the only reason I can see to do projection is if you want a funky bad rear projection look.




-- J.S.
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#6 Tony Brown

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 01:00 PM

If I had a £ for every time I've said blue screen this week......
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#7 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 01:50 PM

You know, Tony, I think John might be on to something, there. Have you thought about shooting it against blue or green? I hear that technique is getting quite advanced, now.

Hat, coat...

P
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#8 Tony Brown

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 01:53 PM

You know, Tony, I think John might be on to something, there. Have you thought about shooting it against blue or green? I hear that technique is getting quite advanced, now.

Hat, coat...

P


I knew I shouldn't have started this.... :lol:
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#9 John Sprung

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Posted 10 August 2010 - 04:41 PM

Are you shooting film or digital? If it's digital, they'll see whether it's working immediately. In either case, maybe get some extra HMI's and a bunch of very blue gel, and do alternate takes with blue light instead of projection on the screen. It's a question of time mostly whether you can afford to CYA both ways like that.....




-- J.S.
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CineLab

FJS International, LLC

rebotnix Technologies

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