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Leicina Special experience?


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#1 Vincent Sweeney

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 10:04 AM

Dear S8 experts,

Can the Leicina Special or the Nizo 6080 still be serviced? If so, by whom?

Will the Special do 24fps?

Also, is it possible to put 16:9 frame lines each? Can they go SuperDuper8/Max8 do you think? Maybe it's a sin but I have to ask.

What's the downside of these cameras that may not be obvious after reading as much as one can on the net about it?

What makes the Special seemingly more stable than other S8 cams if it is sharing the same film cassette/gate technology all the rest are? Is this just rumor?

How good/practical/functional are the viewfinders on each?

I assume each one still needs a barney for sound indoors?

Sorry for so many questions. I'm trying to prep for a likely special project this spring. The film will go through a 2K scan for HD mastering. Money isn't really an issue in this case, as far as camera rental goes so I'm trying to research the best overall S8 cam for sharpness, reliability, practical use on a set and noise level. I've narrowed it down to the Special with the 6-66 or the 9008 (from Du-All) or the Nizo 6080, so far, and this selection is partly due to noise levels or I'd likely just go with one of 4008's that Pro8 has. I'm also looking into rigging up a crude video tap possibly, on whatever is chosen.

Thanks to Michael's sticky post for leading me in a good direction!
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#2 andy oliver

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 06:29 PM

Hi, i'll start the ball rolling, hopefully others will chip in.

The Nizo, imo avoid, unless fully serviced. The internal drive mech relies on a belt, over time this belt stretches causing tranports issue with the camera. The Nizo is a very quiet running camera. Optics not in the same league as the 6-66 lens.

Certainly the 9008 can easily be ( if not already fitted ) fitted with 16-9 markings.

Quietest runing is the Nizo, 9008 then Special.

Most reliable is the Leicina.

Leicina viewfinder is ok but not the best, Beaulieu 7008 pro ( assume 9008 is similiar ) is brighter and easier to focus.

Leicina is possibly the easiest to convert for a video tap. ( see photograph attached )

If you can shoot your project using a fixed focal length lens, and if you can find one, i would opt for a 9008 with 10mm isco-cinegon.

I would opt for a 9008, given they are a quieter running camera than the Special.

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#3 Nicholas Kovats

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 09:29 PM

Andy.

Can you please post details of your video tap setup? Camera? Machined adapter? etc?

Vincent.

The Leicina is a serious box like scientific research camera. Robust, durable and built like a precision tank albeit with the worst designed handle ever. Not for human operators anyway. But the thing mounts almost anywhere. I had it recently mounted on my bike for Kodachrome time exposure shots.

I love the clarity of the minimalist cross hair viewfinder. Tack sharp and as bright as the optic attached to it. The 10mm Cinegon combo will produce what appears to be 16mm film footage levels of resolution. . The slightly concave (ceramic?) film channel provides horizontal and vertical stability during film transport.

The STI battery/intervalometer really shows of the electro-mechanical shutter allowing 0.5 sec to 3 min plus exposure times. Your stuck with default Euro 25 fps. But this loud beast was not built for sync sound.

The Beaulieu is a much more comfortable handheld instrument. Sync sound S8 eh? In fact the belt driven Nizo 6080 is the way to go for quiet sync sound work. Check this 6080 sync example, i.e.



This filmmaker simply pulled the non sync audio into "sync" by slipping the audio track in a NLE. Brilliant and simple.
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#4 Vincent Sweeney

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 10:29 PM

Thanks for the response guys. I like Nizo, owning a 560 myself, but I would have to locate a 6080 that has been serviced it looks like. Any ideas on who may have one or can do that?

DuAll has a 9008 we can rent. I was surprised at their purchase price though. I assume they were $10k new?

I wonder how the 6080's Schneider 7 - 80mm compares sharpness wise, between F2.8 and F8, to the Canon 1014's 6.5-65mm or the 560's Schneider 7-56 mm at the same stop range?
(I list those two because I know them for reference)

The Special is out for me since it can't do 24fps.
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#5 Andries Molenaar

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Posted 06 January 2011 - 05:21 PM

The Leicina and Beaulieu are easy on maintenance as there no rubber belts. And parts can be re-manufactured of transplanted from donor-machines.

I don't think the Special is all that noisy.
Many cameras may seem noisy when you have them at your face. The sound level at the place of the microphone should be judged.

I doubt overhauled 6080 actually do get new belts. The rest of it is maintenance free. So what are you spending money on? There is no insurance on it.
If you find one nice and quiet run a test film and that would be it.

The 9008 (but not all) has 16:9 markings. After all it are refurbished 6008 with repainted bodies and some mods built in.
I don't see any advantage over using 6008 or 7008. Unless you want a full frame ground glass.
There are far more 6008s :)
Just be sure to run it with a 9 volt powersource or a 8.4 volt pack. This makes the camera far more lively/energetic.

At these arms and legs charging businesses. What garantees do you get? Swap or money back. Nothing beyond that.
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#6 Tony Rudd

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Posted 08 January 2011 - 04:05 AM

I think the Mekel trumps them all for image quality, features and service. They don't break!I would look at using good quality 16mm primes or zoom if you can I am not impressed by the performance of the c mount super8 zooms.
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#7 fabian gebbert

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 05:23 AM

i have the nizo 6080 for 2 years now. i already filmed about 8 rolls with it. its very silent and reliable. no problems, perfect German engineering ;)

here you see some footage with a HD scan and one roll 64T: (please note: the "jumping image" at the start is not from the cam! i worked on the tripod.


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#8 fabian gebbert

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 05:30 AM

addition: it never ever has been serviced since it was build (30 years old). the problem is, that many 6080 in the US are the last production (i read) and not of good quality. here in germany the 6080 is perfect. the only problem mine has: i broke the viewfinder. i have to guess by my self if its sharp. :/
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#9 Chris Burke

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 01:05 PM

Vincent,

Here is an example of a Nizo 6080. I bought it from someone on this site and have had Duall service it. It is a great camera that is barely needs a barney for dialogue.


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#10 andy oliver

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Posted 12 January 2011 - 05:10 PM

Andy.

Can you please post details of your video tap setup? Camera? Machined adapter? etc?

Vincent.


Hi, the camera was purchased at a uk camera fair, just an ordinary 400 line mini b/w cctv camera, the black unit that fits onto the viewfinder tube is a leicina accessory known as the Leicina Special Right Angle Finder Adapter 22221. My cousin works for a precision engeering firm and came up with a sleeve to sit around the cctv camera and the method of securing the camera to the RA Adapter ( basically 4 allen screws ). I guess sourcing the R A Adapter mave prove the hardest job.

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#11 Hugo Codinach

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 08:49 PM

Hi, the camera was purchased at a uk camera fair, just an ordinary 400 line mini b/w cctv camera, the black unit that fits onto the viewfinder tube is a leicina accessory known as the Leicina Special Right Angle Finder Adapter 22221. My cousin works for a precision engeering firm and came up with a sleeve to sit around the cctv camera and the method of securing the camera to the RA Adapter ( basically 4 allen screws ). I guess sourcing the R A Adapter mave prove the hardest job.



Hi Andy,

Sorry to bring back an old thread, but your video tap solution looks great and is so inspiring! I have been trying to make something similar on my Leicina Super RT1 but I couldn't figure out how. Do you send the video to a small display? I wonder how it looks like. What brand is cctv camera you used?

Finally, just out of curiosity, where did you find the adapter? you were right, this thing is really hard to find...

Thank you so much!
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