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16mm Zeiss Super Speeds on Beaulieu 4008ZM


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#1 Peter Van Scherpe

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Posted 09 February 2011 - 01:32 PM

I am looking to shoot a 5 minute piece using my Beaulieu 4008ZM super 8 camera and I was thinking of renting a set of Zeiss Super Speed Primes that are used on 16mm cameras. The primes have bayonet mounts and I have a Century Optics adapter. Has anyone tried this or know if do or does not work?
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#2 Oliver Christoph Kochs

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Posted 09 February 2011 - 03:25 PM

Has anyone tried this or know if do or does not work?

You probably know that you will not have a wide angle here. The 16mm lenses will perform like tele-lenses on the 4008. c-mount adaptor should work with the arri bayo. Do a test.
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#3 Oliver Christoph Kochs

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Posted 09 February 2011 - 03:25 PM

Double post plz remove.
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#4 kevin jackman

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Posted 10 February 2011 - 11:41 PM

that depends on the focal lengths. if say he uses a set like 8mm, 16mm, 25mm he will have kick ass images that fit the format. most people use old average glass, usually zooms, thinking its the best thing since sliced bread.
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#5 Will Montgomery

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Posted 13 February 2011 - 03:29 PM

I am looking to shoot a 5 minute piece using my Beaulieu 4008ZM super 8 camera and I was thinking of renting a set of Zeiss Super Speed Primes that are used on 16mm cameras.

ummmm.... why? Seems kind of overkill for the format.
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#6 Tim Carroll

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Posted 13 February 2011 - 03:45 PM

Not sure I would go with a set of Zeiss Super Speeds. It's interesting, lenses are designed for different formats. The Super Speeds are designed for 16mm. The Zeiss Standard Speeds are designed for 35mm. Zeiss, to my knowledge, never made a lens set for 8mm.

What I'm trying to say is that the lenses were designed with a certain frame size in mind, and a certain magnification, if you will. The Standard Speeds, for 35mm, don't need to be as sharp/high contrast as the Super Speeds, because they are projecting their image on a bigger negative that will not be blown up as much for presentation. The Super Speeds need to be sharper/higher contrast for 16mm so when the image is blown up more, you still get acceptable perceived sharpness.

Now step down to 8mm. For 8mm I would want the sharpest/highest contrast lenses possible, because the little 8mm negative gets really blown up in presentation, so you want as much perceived sharpness as you can get. I don't think the Zeiss Super Speeds will give you that.

From testing most of the lenses available for 16mm over the years, I have found the Cooke Kinetal lenses to be some of the sharpest/highest contrast lenses available for 16mm. They are far sharper and higher contrast than Zeiss Super Speeds. I don't know if there were ever any made for 8mm. Also the Kern Switar lenses are very sharp and high contrast. And Kern Switar actually makes them for 8mm. I would look for a set of those if you can.

Best,
-Tim
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#7 Dom Jaeger

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Posted 14 February 2011 - 02:52 AM

the Kern Switar lenses are very sharp and high contrast. And Kern Switar actually makes them for 8mm. I would look for a set of those if you can.


Most Kern lenses designed for 8mm have a D-mount and much shorter flange depth than the C-mount fitted Beaulieu 4008. The only 8mm Kerns with a C-mount are for reflex H8 cameras, but the back focus is still too short. So the only compatible Kerns are for the H16, preferably non-reflex ones (ie not marked RX).

As far as 8mm Zeiss lenses go - Zeiss did make some interchangeable 8mm format lenses for the early, pre-war Zeiss Ikon Movikon 8 models, with a bayonet mount. Their later 8mm lenses were fixed onto the cameras (Movikon and Movinette, Moviflex S8). The East German Zeiss (Zeiss Jena) made a range of lenses for the Pentacon Pentaflex 8 - the only 8mm camera ever made with a spinning reflex mirror - but I believe those lenses also have a bayonet mount unique to the camera.

Personally, I think 16mm Super Speeds (that aren't too beaten up) would be more than adequate for Super 8. But Switars or Kinetals would certainly be nice too.

As someone previously noted, the biggest problem will be finding a wide angle.
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#8 Peter Van Scherpe

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Posted 18 February 2011 - 06:33 PM

I want to thank everyone who has either posted a response to my initial question or send me an email. I did locate a set of Kinetals but their mount is not a bayonet, C-mount or PL. As soon as the rain stops here in San Francisco Bay area I will shot a test roll using the Zeiss primes and the zoom that came with the camera, an Angenieux-Zoom F. 8-64mm 1:1.9 Type 8X8B. I plan to use Kodak Vision 3 T200.
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